| Author | Message | ||
| Bigal Registered user Username: Bigal Post Number: 69 Registered: 9-2006  |
FAF Family, My wife pointed this out to me this morning and I wanted to bring this to you all to see what you think. __________________ 2 Peter 1:20-21 20 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation. 21 For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. __________________ My thought is that if the SDA church says that EGW’s writing were inspired, but allowing for a human interpretation to fit her era or situation, then this opens up her writings to be tested by the 2 Peter 1:20-21 warning. Is this not a correct understanding of Peter and recent push within SDAism to reinterpret EGW? I am constantly amazed at what I keep stumbling upon in the Bible! It’s as if directed to/at me at times. Alan | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 668 Registered: 6-2006  |
Alan, I don't have anything to add, but here is the verse in context - 18We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain. 19And we have the word of the prophets made more certain, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. 20Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation. | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1033 Registered: 9-2006  |
I like this version a little better Peter II 1:20 knowing this first (firstly, before all and foremost), that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, Peter II 1:21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. Words in brackets are mine. First of all she was a woman, second of all if you will look at verse 1:19 the writeer is saying that prophecy before hand has been confirmed. First of all she was a woman and not a Holy man of God; second of all her prophecy/s has not been confirmed. The writer is stressing “Knowing this first, first of all and before everything and he did not say “holy men/women of God he said “men” and you can verify that through other scripture. Women do have the “gift of prophecy” nowadays, but it is for the upbuilding and edification of the church body which is totally different than the spill she gives out. They run her out as an old time prophet, not as having the “gift of prophecy” although they try to tie her to that also, it just does not work for she does not upbuild the body of Christ, she tears down and causes confusion rather then edification, if one brings a prophecy or tongues and interpretations it is to be judged by those standing by, they have to hear it to do that and what is being said must line up with scripture, not add to it or subtract anything. No matter what they do to try to justify her through the word they will come up with problems. IMHO. River | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6276 Registered: 12-2003  |
Great observation, Alan--and River, your anaylsis is so true. Colleen | ||
| Timmy Registered user Username: Timmy Post Number: 197 Registered: 8-2006  |
Speaking of inspiration... What's up with Tedjususchristgod??? Notice he says they can "prove" Ted is Jesus with the Bible and EGW. http://tedjesuschristgod.org/ What comes to my mind is, "Birds of a feather..." | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1034 Registered: 9-2006 |
I ask my Pastor whether he remembered women being use in the old time prophets last night, there were known prophetess’s but I just can’t bring to mind what they prophesied about, my pastor said the verse may have meant man kind and so I have to qualify that statement about the men. Its that just for the life of me I cannot remember where God used these women or how. Anyhow I don’t want to leave the ladies out just yet; maybe Jeremy or someone can pipe in and tell us about this portion of scripture. But the main point being that she was not confirmed because her words were not able to line up and she only brought confusion, consternation and doubt to the table so she is to be ignored as “nothing”. She is to be taken completely out of the equation and go back and read the scripture without interference from anyone’s own private interpretation or we follow to our peril. There is no doubt that Adventist build on her word, (filter the word through her word) but when we do that friends we build a straw house. No doubt there are many men and women of God who have a good thing to say about the scripture and life in general and we can mine for those nuggets of wisdom from them and each other, It is no doubt that I have grown in the word since I came to this forum, but we seek for wisdom in the word to follow hard after the Lord and that is the difference, if Adventist would ignore her words and lay them aside and read the Bible for themselves I have no doubt that they would come up singing a different tune. People have set her up as an inspired authority and raised their children and taught others to do the same, but friends I worry for them, it sets mind teeth on edge how ever innocently this is done. I am uneasy when men begin to follow men and depend on them as ultimate guides, the Lord himself writes on the tables of our heart. That is why I have stressed so much getting rid of the flotsam and jetsam of Adventism, lay it aside and go back and read the word prayerfully and let the Lord speak to your heart through the word and follow hard after Jesus. I will try to give a poor example here, I have an electronic welding helmet, and it allows me to see the object I am welding however dimly without raising my hood up and down and just aiming at the object, pulling my helmet down and really starting blind. And when I am able to do this I am able to start my weld at the proper place and the light gets bright when I start to weld. If we look at the word prayerfully however dimly I believe God himself will shine brightly through and give us hope and confidence as we look to him for guidance and as Alan said, it shines at us and in us and we make new discoveries as we look to him and we can go rejoicing in his love and grace. Then we can declare with the psalmist “Thy word oh God is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path. I suppose I am aired out. Back to ya. River | ||
| Marysroses Registered user Username: Marysroses Post Number: 80 Registered: 4-2007 |
Hey River, I remember Miriam, Hannah, Abigail and Deborah listed as prophets of the OT. I think Esther as well. I know the first four are generally accepted by Jews as prophets. I think something to remember in studying the role of prophets is how it has changed. In our culture, 'prophet' and 'prophecy' bring instantly to mind predictions of the future, and that is seen so much as the primary function of prophecy that it is accepted as the definition of the word. In Old Testament times, a prophet was much more than a predictor of future events. Prediction was only part of the role. There were sacred writings but no established canon of scripture. Prophets preached and told people what God wanted of them, and called people back to God and the Covenant. Predictions were like prods to get people to change their behavior. "If you don't turn back to God, XX will happen....." Prophets could tell true sayings about people, uncovering unbelief and sins to the community, for the purpose of bringing about repentance. In that context female prophets make sense. Their mission was to the women of the community, who have concerns and need direction,and yea, have sins, that would have been indelicate for men to address. MarysRoses | ||
| Bobj Registered user Username: Bobj Post Number: 228 Registered: 1-2006  |
Timmy Thanks for sharing about Ted, above. Deuteronomy 18 gives the defining test between a true and false prophet. Does Ted make any unconditional and unfulfilled prophecies? Until we are willing to apply the Bible's test of a true prophet (no false prophecies) to every prophet that comes along, there will be no defense against the next Ellen White, Joseph Smith, David Koresh, or Ted-the-next! The Bible warns us that many false prophets will come, and false christs. There is a burden on us to apply the test, evaluate the results, and act with integrity. Many will be decieved. Bob | ||
| Marysroses Registered user Username: Marysroses Post Number: 81 Registered: 4-2007 |
OH WOW I just looked at the Ted site. That is too weird. One thing that got to me when I was still in high school was how many people take Adventist end times stuff and run with it, right out of the Adventist Church way WAY out into 'left field'. At my mother's church, which of course I was attending as a member at that time, The teacher of the small SDA School which my younger brother and sister attended, got it into her head that she was the new SDA prophetess. She managed to convince a significant portion of the local church membership. There was finally a split and about a third of the membership began meeting in homes. 30 years later, I see one of them once in a while, none of them are attending church anywhere and are thoroughly disillusioned with Christianity entirely. At about the same time in an SDA church about 200 miles from here, a woman similarly became convinced she was the new EGW, and when asked to quit peddling her views at the local SDA church or leave, she barricaded herself inside threatening suicide and mayhem and had to be dragged out by the local police. Of course any community can have incidents with unbalanced people, but these were not the only incidents. I later felt when I was out of the home and in college that I was being pulled in two directions. Either into a total cynicism about Adventism, or much deeper into it. Abandoning reason and letting myself go into wholesale acceptance of EGW, the end times, sunday laws, EVERYTHING, had an attraction. There's such hubris in thinking that you are one of the remnant, you have the knowledge that no one else does, etc. (The sweet temptation of Gnosticism, before I could define such a thing!). One thing that kept me from going over the edge and continuing to use reason, was remembering those women and how bitterly divisive their actions were on the church community. It seemed to me that once you suspended reason and critical thinking, it would be easy to end up like them, or following one of them. MarysRoses | ||
| Marysroses Registered user Username: Marysroses Post Number: 82 Registered: 4-2007 |
I'd like to add to the above comment, that it was about this time that the Jonestown incident happened. That had a profound impact on me, because of the similarities between Jim Jones and Jonestown and some of the extreme SDAs I had met who were wanting to establish SDA communes out in the wilderness etc. Did Jonestown shake anyone else here into rethinking the idea of a modern prophet? | ||
| Reb Registered user Username: Reb Post Number: 332 Registered: 5-2007 |
Ummmm I just checked out that Ted website. Was he an Adventist at one time? The stuff he says doesn't even make any sense. | ||
| Jonvil Registered user Username: Jonvil Post Number: 69 Registered: 4-2007 |
He needs to be locked up for his own safety! | ||
| Reb Registered user Username: Reb Post Number: 333 Registered: 5-2007 |
I agree Jonvil. That guy is totally whacko! | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1037 Registered: 9-2006 |
I agree with you Reb, wacko! Marysroses you made some good points there about the prophets. Thanks River | ||
| Reb Registered user Username: Reb Post Number: 335 Registered: 5-2007 |
Are there people out there that believe this guy? I don't know how ANYONE could believe him. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 3969 Registered: 3-2004  |
I just looked at his website also. Completely non Christian. Focus on Ted and not on Christ. Thank you God, for showing us how to avoid being taken in by a false prophet. Diana | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 670 Registered: 6-2006 |
Is that Ted Kazinski the "Uni-bomber"? Hehe! May as well be, huh? I just don't understand these people who are basically Chicken Little. The Bible says that no one knows the time or the day, and that it will happen like a theif in the night. So why worry and then try and freak everyone else out? In the words of the immortal Agent 86, Maxwell Smart... "Expect it when you least expect it!"  Leigh Anne | ||
| Timmy Registered user Username: Timmy Post Number: 198 Registered: 8-2006 |
The guy must have fried his noodle reading to many of those 'red' books... Thank God for the black ONE. | ||
| Reb Registered user Username: Reb Post Number: 336 Registered: 5-2007 |
I've had the thought cross my mind that Adventism can be as bad for the mind as dope. This dude kinda proves it at least in his case. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 3973 Registered: 3-2004 |
Timmy, I like what you said above "The guy must have fried his noodle reading to many of those 'red' books... Thank God for the black ONE." A hearty AMEN to that. Diana |
