| Author |
Message |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3278
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 1:19 pm: |     |
I discovered, after being out of adventism for a while, that I did not have to have an answer for everything. That is so freeing. I can say I don't know, but I will study into it. Isn't God awesome in how He teaches us?
Diana |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 340
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 6:49 pm: | |
As and after I was leaving Adventism, the only things I felt compelled to study were the essentials: Who was Jesus? What does salvation mean and how do we get it and keep it? What role does the Law play? What does it mean, the New Covenant?
Afterwards I took things as they came along. Once I knew keeping the Law was not necessary to retaining my salvation, I was able to relax and bask in the love of Jesus. I felt as though I was finding out who He was all over again. I had lost that love for Jesus after I became an Adventist. Of course, I had good, solid bible-based sermons twice a week to ground me in the Scriptures.
I no longer had to worry about having it all "right" to ensure I would finally make it to heaven. Now I know God will teach me and lead me as He sees fit and I rest in that comfort.
Susan |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 350
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 7:56 pm: | |
River, you said concerning the state of the dead doctrine: "I never could see why the Adventist get in such a tizzy over that one. one of my Adventist associates got really adamant about his belief and I ask him how he supposed Moses got into the Garden with Jesus to have a meetin' He never did give me an answer though."
The reason some Adventists get all in a tizzy over that is because EGW said it is right up there with the 2 most deadly errors in Christianity: the immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness. The person who dies has to cease to exist, because spirit is equated with breath. And, if a person ceases to exist after death, then they can't come back and talk to you, because that is spiritism.
Funny thing, though...EGW talked to her dead husband James on more than one occasion. Another example of the double standard in Adventism, and especially of the prophet-"do as I say, and not as I do."
Susan
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Helovesme2
Registered user
Username: Helovesme2
Post Number: 780
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 8:13 pm: | |
 The SDAs explain Moses as having been resurrected before the time he met with Jesus on that mountain (based at least partly on Jude). In fact some of them make rather much of the fact that it was Moses - as representative of those who 'sleep and will be resurrected' (Moses), and those who 'will be translated without seeing death' (Elijah).
The transfiguration is therefore used to strengthen their 'state of the dead' position and is simultaneously robbed of its strength as a lesson in the disciples being urged to focus on Jesus alone in the "This is my beloved Son, hear Him."
It is sad. |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 353
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 8:24 pm: | |
Absolutely, Mary, it is very sad, and another example as to how the Adventist "truths" minimize Jesus. |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3284
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 8:36 pm: | |
It was not until I left adventism that I learned the lesson of Moses and Elijah with Jesus and the Father saying, "This is my beloved Son, Hear Him." That makes so much more sense. Everything pointed to Jesus.
Diana |
Bobj
Registered user
Username: Bobj
Post Number: 83
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 8:44 pm: | |
I remember that I felt just sick after reading Dale Ratzlaf's books because I knew what I was reading was true. The Holy Spirit left no doubt!
As an SDA layman, I had led out in preaching (and also shared the speaking) in a couple of evangelistic meetings in California and Ecuador. I had been quite defensive about Adventism for many years, but the Lord led me to continue studying and led me to really start trusting Himóa novel idea, to say the least! I thought I trusted Him, but my theology denied it.
I often wonder about the people who came to Christ during those meetings. I wonder about those who left the meetings. What did they hear us say? Did they leave the Lord, forever, after what we told them about the law and the Sabbath? Was God actually shielding them? I pray that the Lord will not forget them. If I could go back and fix things, I would. Amazing how God can change hearts.
When the Lord began to lift the veil, I made phone calls to a number of people with whom I had spoken to (over the years) about Adventism. For about 15 years I worked in a county public health department in southern California, and I had a lot of conversations with co-workers. A couple were even baptized, but I donít take credit for that. I called them because I believe that our words and our influence are important, and I wanted to be honest with them (I owe them the truth, even if my own reputation and pride takes a dive) and faithful to the leading of the Lord. It's all about Him!
Weíre soon going to be with the Lord, and I donít want to mess around on eternally important things, like adding to the gospel.
Bob
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Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3285
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 9:02 pm: | |
Bob,
God understands from where you came and as Colleen has told me and others He does not waste anything from our past. It took a lot of courage to call people. I admire what God has done for you that led you to do that.
Yes, we are going to be with the Lord and I, also, do not want to mess around on eternally important things. If we do not meet in Redlands, we will meet in heaven at Jesus feet.
Diana |
Tkmommy
Registered user
Username: Tkmommy
Post Number: 12
Registered: 1-2007
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 9:29 pm: | |
Susans, EGW "talked" to her dead husband? I had never heard that before (although it doesn't suprise me in the least)...was this she "saw" him in vision or something like that...?
Oh so curious!
Tami |
Jeremy
Registered user
Username: Jeremy
Post Number: 1669
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 08, 2007 - 10:01 pm: | |
Tami, check out this link: http://www.truthorfables.com/EGW_Talking_to_the_Dead_James.htm
Jeremy |
Lrcrabtree
Registered user
Username: Lrcrabtree
Post Number: 14
Registered: 1-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 09, 2007 - 6:47 am: | |
Wow, I was totally unaware of this 'speaking with the dead' episode. When I read the first few posts, I expected to read another one of her "the angel of the Lord took me to a place, where..." situation; arguably another vision similar to those so commonly published. I was surprised to read the actual letter, where she gets right to it and says that it was a dream and she saw James, no angelic leading or interpretation, then attributes it to divine guidance from God. I'll bet that only about 2% of Adventists know about this letter or this episode.
Larry |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 358
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 09, 2007 - 5:43 pm: | |
I bet you are right, Larry, but more and more Adventists having access to these letters on the internet are finding out the true history and "story" of the denomination and the prophet.
BTW, when I was coming out of Adventism, and I went to those web sites, I did NOT just take their words as the truth. I had over 1000 SDA books, including all the testimonies, the confict of the ages, all the individual red books and compilations, the 20 volumes of manuscript releases, the R&H and Signs articles facsimiles, the 1888 message 4 volume set, and many other hard to find books from various independent publishing houses on EGW's writings, including the older versions of the Great Controversy. I had an extensive library of pamphlets as well, like "A Word to the Little Flock", and I was able to go back to my OWN BOOKS to verify that what I was reading was indeed what was written. (I got rid of EVERYTHING in 2002)
For this reason, once I read Dirk's site, and others, I never looked back.
Susan |
Jorgfe
Registered user
Username: Jorgfe
Post Number: 273
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 09, 2007 - 7:02 pm: | |
Something I found amazing is how EGW got the Fox sisters all wrong. The truth is totally different than what I was taught!
http://www.ellenwhite.org/egw54.htm
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Randyg
Registered user
Username: Randyg
Post Number: 345
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 12:23 am: | |
Gilbert,
It is so nice to see and hear from you again.
I so enjoyed your blog, I still check occasionally to see if there are any updates. |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 365
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 3:24 am: | |
So do I! Thanks, Gilbert and nice to "see" you again, too!
Susan |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 5238
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 9:41 am: | |
Gilbert, thanks for the link. You always have interesting "stuff"!
Still praying for you and yours,
Colleen |
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