| Author | Message | ||
| Schasc Registered user Username: Schasc Post Number: 44 Registered: 10-2004 |
I am looking for a little advice on what you all think Christ meant when He said "be in the world, but not of the world" As I was growing up, the Adventist church always applied this to how one dresses, refraining from having athletics in school,not eating pork etc........How should we be applying this statement as Christians? Any insights from this group would be greatly appreciated | ||
| Lynne Registered user Username: Lynne Post Number: 111 Registered: 10-2005 |
It means Christians are to live in the world along with lost sinners. Christians shouldn't hide. Luke 8:16 - "No one lights a lamp and hides it in a jar or puts it under a bed. Instead, he puts it on a stand, so that those who come in can see the light. God our Savior, wants all men to be saved. How can this happen if Christians hide themselves or the Gospel of Jesus Christ? When Jesus lives in us and we hide ourselves, are we not hiding Jesus from the world? We are not to live like the world. Matthew 9:36 -When he saw the crowds, he felt sorry for them. They were confused and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd. Are Christians to be lost and helpless? Like sheep without a shepherd? Romans 13:12-14 - 12The night is nearly over; the day is almost here. So let us put aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light. 13Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy. 14Rather, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and do not think about how to gratify the desires of the sinful nature. In the world = Clothed in Jesus Not of the world = In the Flesh Christians should clothe themselves in the Lord Jesus Christ. Don't try to gratify whatever your sinful weaknesses are (drunkeness, greed, whatever). We are no longer slaves to sin as the world is and as we were before we were saved. It has nothing to do with what one eats or whether the girdle worn by ladies in the day of Ellen White had curves or not. The Holy Spirit convicts us of right and wrong when we are saved. We will know what is and is not sin. Adventists live by the law and are not saved. Adventists are told that they will be saved by the law (by keeping the Sabbath). That is not the Gospel of Grace. The gospel of free grace is for healing and saving souls. Telling people they are wrong in this world for how they dress or for what they eat, well - John 3:17 - For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him. To save the world through Him, not through laws, or appropriate behavior. The laws just try to control the flesh. I'm free now - I'm not in the flesh being controlled by the law! In the world = Clothed in Jesus Not of the world = In the Flesh | ||
| Loneviking Registered user Username: Loneviking Post Number: 398 Registered: 7-2000 |
To me, it means a real world faith. What makes us 'different' is our morals and our faith. There is nothing to prevent us from being soldiers, mechanics, police officers, lawyers or doctors. All occupations are needed. It means that we belong to many of the same organizations as our neighbors---Kiwanis, Rotary, Elks. It means that we interact with our neighbors. It means that we have friends who aren't Christian. It means that we go to parties where there is (gasp!) alchohol, and folks are dancing to music. It's involvement with the real world around us. Yes, there are a few absolutes that we can't be involved in---but those are very few. | ||
| Cy Registered user Username: Cy Post Number: 31 Registered: 1-2005 |
Just earlier today I was thinking about how isolated I felt when I attended boarding academy at DAA. For three years of my life (sophomore through senior) at academy, I had very little connection to the outside world other than weekly phone calls with family. It seems we had to be separate from the world to maintain our "purity". Now when I read "be in the world but not of the world," I see so clearly that it means what Lynne wrote above, not to be isolated. Cy | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 2063 Registered: 3-2004  |
As an SDA I felt so isolated and did not know how to touch others not of the SDA religion. Being a Christian now, I can go and do things and let others know I am a Christian and have FUN doing it. I did not enjoy life as an SDA. Now I am not longer isolated and have loads of fun as a Christian. Lynne, I like what you wrote. Diana | ||
| Schasc Registered user Username: Schasc Post Number: 45 Registered: 10-2004 |
Thanks for your input. As I discover more and more what Christ really wants for us, I run into many roadblocks that I think the devil puts up at my current place of employment. It is encouraging to hear voices that dont hold the old party line! Cy when were you at DAA? I knew some students from there and a faculty memeber or two..........anyway thanks again | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3007 Registered: 12-2003  |
Lynne, I also liked what you wrote! In a nutshell, I think being in the world but not of the world is the condition of being born from above: indwelt by the Holy Spirit and having our spirits brought from death to life. Once that happens, we then have the choice to live by the Spirit or not. Having a living spirit and living by the Spirit (continual surrender of our reactions/impulses/desires) to Jesus and having the power of God to live with integrity instead of compromise is being in the world but not of it. It's an amazing new reality! Colleen | ||
| Cy Registered user Username: Cy Post Number: 32 Registered: 1-2005 |
Schasc, I was at DAA from 1982 through 1985. BTW, I don't mean to complain about the people at DAA. Many teachers and administrators were very caring, committted Christian people. It was the SDA educational system and its physical, spiritual, civic, and social isolation that I felt. I really appreciate the freedom I have now in Christ! Cy | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 786 Registered: 7-2004 |
We live by faith, not by sight. We also must trust and surrender to the promises made by our Savior. Those promises are multitude, and the repetition of the promises made through scripture, both OT and NT, are many. Jesus made it clear, as did Paul, that a new order of salvation was at hand, and only those who grasp it by faith will possess it. Living in accordance with a list of instructions (laws) is easier for materialistic human beings who crave something to do. We work for a wage. We prepare a dinner before we can eat. Jesus will pay our wage, He feeds on on his words. These are aspects that cannot be seen or touched, so we accept them as our own by faith through trust and surrender. There is absolutely no requirement of a "doingness." We are in the world by material birth, but by virtue of the new birth from Heaven we are no longer citizens of earth, but of Heaven. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3016 Registered: 12-2003 |
Thank you, Belva. So well said. Colleen | ||
| Olga Registered user Username: Olga Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2005 |
It was hard growing up Adventist; I had very few friends outside the church, which was probably better that way since you couldn't really go visit, celebrate their birthdays (if their party was on the Sabbath), couldn't go to their Saturday weddings or BBQ parties, and forget about parties on Sundays (if there was any boozing around) you get the idea. When I eventually rebelled against the religion, I sort of went overboard and it was only through God's grace that I am still alive today. Freedom tasted so sweet for a while! Maybe God knew not even this kind of freedom would satisfy my inner longings. For me, things got harder when I went back to the church in '95 (2 years after marrying); Gary (my hubby) always said I changed so much and it got hard on him too as I wouldn't join him and his family on their gatherings if held on a Saturday (especially since I always felt uncomfortable with their drinking). The Pharisees were always on Jesus' back because he was friendly and would drink and eat with "sinners." I guess Jesus was showing us the way; he surely wasn't hiding from the people, he went where they went. Jesus revealed himself to others by relating in real ways and situations with the people. How compassionate! He was not of this world but he sure didn't shy away from our joys nor from our pains - he went to weddings, dinners, and funerals. | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 787 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dear Olga, First, let me welcome you to our ranks. I saw your other post where you mentioned taking a piece of meat onto your plate, but couldn't bring yourself to eat it. You don't have to eat it if you choose not to. Faith has nothing to do with eating and drinking, and that means whether you do, or whether you don't. I recommend being willing to try new things, but if you feel guilty about it, best not to do it. There is nothing that a believer can do to achieve or lose their salvation. Salvation is fully, 100% the work of God, and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit is the stamp upon the soul that you now belong, forevermore, to God. For some, the indwelling is a momentous experience, for others it is a quiet peace. No matter what your experience is, please know that you are now marked for all time by the Holy Spirit, and He will lead you into all righteousness. That means that you can drop the reins (surrender) and learn what it feels like to walk by faith. I think it may be harder than others for a person with a SDA background to surrender to the Holy Spirit. Adventism has so many lists of what is right and what is wrong that it just stands to reason that you are used to regimentation. I remember a girl once who was put on such intense restrictions regarding food that she had never ever tasted butter. Once she got away from her overpowering mother she sat down and ate a whole cube of butter all by itself. Doing that made her feel sluggish and out of sorts, and she wondered what all the fuss about butter was, but when she used that particular food appropriately she found it to be wonderful. The same can be said about any food or drink. All things in moderation, and some things just aren't meant for your particular plate. No matter. Listen to your body, listen to your soul. If something just doesn't feel right, you can choose not to make it a part of your life. Indeed, you should allow yourself to enjoy life, laugh at jokes, dance at weddings, mourn at funerals, and when you go to someone else's home, at least taste what is on your plate. Belva | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 1059 Registered: 3-2005 |
What is worldliness? I found what I think is a good Biblical treatment here at www.banneroftruth.org/pages/articles/article_detail.php?208 In Adventism worldliness was defined by such external things such as wedding rings (That's right, I remember my parents saying that those worldly southern californians who go to the White Memorial church all wear wedding rings!) or whether you ate meat, drank coffee etc etc. This is clearly not the Biblical definition of it. Rather, it is the world's system of greed, and false doctrines of salvation by works and other things that defines worldly. Stan | ||
| Derrell Registered user Username: Derrell Post Number: 103 Registered: 10-2002 |
Just an opinion, but I think that Godliness is placing God obove everything, and true worldliness is placing one's world before God. This would be idolatry. We normally think about idolatry in terms of money, jewelry, food, etc. I believe that the most insidious form of idolatry comes in the form of Church doctrines and traditions that come before God, because they are atributed to God. Kind of like the Pharisees, they were so protective of God's law, that they killed him. They were the world of their time, location, and circumstances. People have different worlds for their time, location, and circumstances. | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 354 Registered: 8-2004  |
Excellent point Derrell! I agree. The saddest thing about the Pharisees was that they thought they DID know the truth, and therefore refused to see He was right in front of them. Mary | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3031 Registered: 12-2003 |
I agree, Derrell. I remember the "ah-ha" moment I had when I realized the Adventist church was the "world" from which God was calling me. I'd never thought of myself being "of the world" before! Colleen |
