| Author | Message | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 500 Registered: 7-2004 |
Thank you Chris, you are right, but since I feel it will be wonderful enough to spend eternity with Jesus, the reward part seems to keep slipping my mind. Your post brought me back to a little skit that we, as kindergarteners, would play where we wore paper crowns on 13th Sabbath. Do any of the rest of you remember doing that? Some of the crowns had more "stars" because we all got stars for memory verses. That is the genetive point for rewards in my mind. There were times when I had a lot of stars, and times when I didn't. Truth be known, the only song I remember singing, other than "Jesus Loves Me" was the sharing song (I have two dollies and I am glad, you have no dolly, and that's too bad...). We were a poor family, and for a while the only time I got to hold a dolly was during that song. Thanks for the stroll down memory lane. Belva | ||
| Leigh Registered user Username: Leigh Post Number: 114 Registered: 2-2003 |
Regarding rewards in heaven, I tend to agree with Ray Boltz. Thank You For Giving to The Lord (Words and Music by Ray Boltz) I dreamed I went to heaven and You were there with me We walked upon the streets of gold Beside the crystal sea. We heard the angels singing Then someone called your name. You turned and saw this young man And he was smiling as he came. And he said, "Friend you may not know me now" And then he said, "But wait" You used to teach my Sunday School When I was only eight. And every week you would say a prayer Before the class would start. And one day when you said that prayer I asked Jesus in my heart." (Chorus) Thank you for giving to the Lord I am a life that was changed. Thank you for giving to the Lord I am so glad you gave. Then another man stood before you And said, "Remember the time A missionary came to your church And his pictures made you cry. You didn't have much money But you gave it anyway. Jesus took the gift you gave And that's why I am here today." (Chorus) Thank you for giving to the Lord I am a life that was changed. Thank you for giving to the Lord I am so glad you gave. One by one they came Far as the eye could see Each life somehow touched By your generosity. Little things that you had done Sacrifices made. Unnoticed on the earth In heaven now proclaimed. And I know up in heaven You're not supposed to cry. But I am almost sure There were tears in your eyes. As Jesus took your hand And you stood before the Lord. He said, "My child look around you. Great is your reward." (Chorus twice) Thank you for giving to the Lord I am a life that was changed. Thank you for giving to the Lord I am so glad you gave. Thank you for giving to the Lord I am a life that was changed. Thank you for giving to the Lord I am so glad you gave. | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 378 Registered: 3-2005 |
Leigh, Thanks for posting that beautiful song. You have a knack for finding the right song to post as appropriate to the topic of a particular thread. Melissa, You made an excellent point above about the terminology being used by colporteur. A lot of cults are good at using terminology to sound orthodox, but when you unmask what they believe, it is far from orthodoxy. I believe Adventists are best trained at this technique. They will say they believe in salvation by grace, but in practice they don't. Belva, In Sabbath School, we were told EGW taught that we would wear crowns with stars, and those stars represented people we had won to Adventism, and no one would get to heaven without at least one star in their crown. I used to be so frightened, because I hadn't won anybody to Adventism. I thank the Lord for that now. Stan | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2094 Registered: 12-2003  |
Leigh, thank you for the Ray Boltz lyrics. I love that song! Yes, Chris, the underlying theology is everything. When a person is alive in Christ through the indwelling Holy Spirit and is commited to living by the Spirit, all the words mean different things than they mean to a person struggling to observe the law and defend a belief system. I guess this reality is why it's impossible to have a true, open, productive theological conversation between a person who is alive in the Spirit and one who is committed to a belief system other than Jesus alone. The words and their meanings and applications can be argued endlessly. If a person does not see the Bible as the ONLY rule of faith and practice, the divinely revealed word of God, he really can't have a productive conversation with one who does. Only if a person responds to the Holy Spirit sparking a desire for truth can he dare to question his belief system in the pursuit of reality as revealed in Jesus. Ultimately, I've come to believe that what sets people at odds with each other, ultimately, is that some deeply desire to know truth at any cost, and others desire to preserve their perceptions at any cost. Only the Holy Spirit can change a person from a "defender of my own beliefs" into a "surrendered to Jesus alone" person. Colleen | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 504 Registered: 7-2004 |
Jjustinn has begun an interesting discussion regarding change within the church (SDA). Here is the link: http://www.revivalsermons.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=628 What Jjustinn was asking about was based on his observation that it appeared certain persons on the R/S Forum were more willing to see people leave their congregations than to have them stay and effect change within the church structure. At my last glance it should take only about 10 minutes to thoughtfully read through the posts. They are revealing, once again, of the Historic SDA outlook. | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 527 Registered: 7-2004 |
I'm like a moth to the flame. Every now and then I cannot help but want to check in on our former friends at R/S. They are deep into a discussion of Christian Modesty. See for yourselves http://www.revivalsermons.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=638 The last time I have heard a sermon on proper Christian modesty/attire was when ... when I was still attending a SDA church. The sermons I hear now are on the Love of Jesus, the care and feeding of our brothers and sisters in the world ... things like that. I just wanted you to know that the only person that has been trying to point out that Christians are known by their love, by the outgrowth of the fruits of the spirit, is Bill Meade, and it appears he has backed off. Jan was lamenting that she missed him, and where was he when she needed him. Did Bill get denied posting privileges? Does anyone know what is going on with him lately? | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 450 Registered: 3-2005 |
Belva, I got depressed reading that thread. I can't believe people think like that anymore. Larry Lyons made a joke that Bill Mead took a leave of absence to take a course in liberal apologetics. I did find some humor in Colporteur's speculation that eventually everyone would be living in a nudesty colony (that is the way he spelled it) and the conservative women would be the ones wearing skimpy bikini bottoms. That crowd is amazing over there. Stan | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 528 Registered: 7-2004 |
I'm curious about what happened to Bill Mead. He was the one breath of fresh air, and the only other person, besides Jan, who was championing the image of Christians being known by their fruits and their love. I'm simply concerned that he may have been sounding a bit like one of us and had his posting privileged removed the same as we did. That would be so sad because there would be no flavor, no salt, left in that site if he and Jan were to be denied. They still have Bucky and Jjustinn, and they post well, too, but it's looking too much like the thought police have taken over R/S. | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 781 Registered: 10-2004  |
Wow, I just looked at O'Ffill's first post in that thread. 1 Peter 1:23 (NASB) says that we "have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God." So how then can O'Ffill claim that not living the Adventist lifestyle can rot our salvation?!?! The Bible says that it is "imperishable"! It can't rot!! They just don't believe the Bible. The end of his post says, "No, seeking by the grace of Jesus to live a holy lifestyle is not what saves us; but not doing so stands, over time, to rot the salvation that Jesus has so gracious offered to us." So Jesus gives a salvation that is "perishable"?? Jesus does NOT give us a salvation which can ROT!! Jeremy (Message edited by jeremy on June 24, 2005) | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 531 Registered: 7-2004 |
Jeremy, that was the part that got me when I read it last night, and was the main reason why I posted that link. It is that sort of preaching that I had heard every time I went to an Adventist church. That is the reason I gave up in my mid-20's, because I just didn't see how I could be pure enough, good enough, kind enough, or loving enough, to keep the seeds of the gospel and salvation growing in my heart. That was when I thought I had to water those seeds and keep them growing. That was when I thought of them as seeds. The gospel and salvation, I now know, grow strong and lasting through the tender love and efforts of Jesus Christ, and the fact that he has completed the work means that there is no way that any harm can come to them. Jesus has declared that the Gates of Hell can do them no harm. Adventism is a system of fear -- make the people afraid and they will all huddle together like sheep. It doesn't really work that way. Make some people afraid and they will give up. Jesus does not wish to lose those he has given so much to save. He has promised that not one will be lost from his hand, and I believe him. Adventism is what is rotten to the core! | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 186 Registered: 1-2003  |
I was wondering what was happening with Bill Mead as well. I'm almost NEVER on the "other" forum but I've been reading Bill's messages and thoughts for many years. I remember him from the days of the SDA forum on Compuserve. I have always been blessed with his thoughts. I think I have his phone number and I'll try to give him a call this weekend and see how he is doing. Richard rtruitt@mac.com PS: Please keep me in your prayers this weekend. My sister and family are coming down to visit her son, (my nephew) and will be attending church with me. I know that her son has enjoyed his worship with us but not sure how my sister will deal with the contemporary style of worship and praise music. Not sure if I'll be brave enough to break out my "praise banners/flags" with her there for the first time.  I'm smiling as I type this and not really to worried because we serve an awesome and wonderful God and worthy to be praised. Some just have a problem with the diversity of expression that God's people (note the lowercase use of people ) use in worshiping Him. | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 453 Registered: 3-2005 |
Richard, I will be praying for you and your family, and since I was acquainted with one of your sisters (Barbara) at Modesto Academy, say hello for me also. We have a lot in common with our mutual MUA upbringing, and although we have taken slightly different turns in our pilgrimage with regard to SDA, we have so much to celebrate in Christ. Hope to be able to see you again soon. I hope you can get in contact with Bill Mead also. Stan | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 817 Registered: 10-2004 |
I was just looking at RS, and Jan started a thread about the Clear Word. They are also discussing Bible translations. There are only 3 replies so far, but it is an interesting discussion. Larry Lyons said:
Amen! Hehe. Jeremy (Message edited by jeremy on July 02, 2005) | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 486 Registered: 3-2005 |
Jeremy, Larry Lyons finally got one right! Stan | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1674 Registered: 3-2004  |
Stan, When you go to the R/S web site, go to the guest book and read through them. There is one there from Bill Mead and it shows he has a web site of the internet and I think his email address. It has been a while since I have lurked there. I did see Jan's comment about the Clear Word book. Have not been back since so it looks like LL finally got one right. Praise God for that. Diana | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 488 Registered: 3-2005 |
Thanks Diana. I will look for Bill Mead's web site and email when I get a chance, as I know he is a brother in Christ. He probably got kicked off that cultic web site of R/S. Stan | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 553 Registered: 7-2004 |
I've just returned from reading the above-recommended thread. They had a mini-discussion about which apartment in the heavenly sanctuary Christ entered upon his assention. Dwayne told them (correctly) that Jesus entered the Most Holy Place in Heaven because he assended to the right hand of the Father, and how can there be a holier place than at the right hand of the Father. Along comes our friend Colporteur with the following in response: ----- Good try Dwayne, but you may be surprized to find one day that there is a judgment and you are in it. Sin will not be allowed in heaven. Don't forget that the earthly was a pattern of the heavenly. That means that what was on earth is in heaven. When the high priest went into the most holy it was a day of judgement for God's people. On the earthly day of atonement the compartments did not disolve. When the curtain was rent in twain the two compartments did not cease to exist in heaven anymore than they did on earth each year on the day of atonement, rather when the curtain was torn the focus was then taken off of the earthly to the original compartments in heaven and our High Priest who ascended there. You are attempting to wash out the entire sanctuary message of the atonement. That does not line up with Scripture and you know it. The Spirit does not lead contrary to God's Word or ignore the context of the Word to justify skewed translations from manuscripts corrupted by the Vatican. Since we are on the topic, it is good to note that the original ten commandments of which the earthly tablets of stone are a pattern, are in heaven in the most holy place. They're all there just as eternal as God Himself. We can attempt to do away with them here but we cannot tear them out of the heart and mind of God. ps. The SOP was a much better idea than the Clear Word. The SOP was God breathed. ----- The final sentence is what totally creeped me out--his calling of the SOP to be "God breathed." How can that man still be walking the earth and not be struck from the face if it when he makes some of the statements that he does? I was struck by the fact that Dwayne picked up so well on the blended compartments, at least here on earth. The rent curtain, torn top to bottom, made it clear that the dividing wall between God and man had been eliminated by the sacrifice of the perfect Lamb of God. God can now reach out to sinning man (saved sinners are covered in the blood of Jesus, and thus God sees Jesus instead of sin), and sinners can reach out to God (they are protected from destruction by the same blood). There is only one compartment. Perhaps that is why the verbage in Hebrews is a bit fuzzy (depending on what translation you are reading). In KJV it says (Hebrews 9:12) Holy Place. In NIV it says Most Holy Place. Perhaps, because the curtain was rent, it doesn't matter any longer! What I do know is that because Jesus has clothed me in his blood, I look like a Child of God to the Father, and that is enough for me. The Muddled Word, so called Bible of the SDA's has been a source of confusion since it was first sold until this very day. I can agree with Col on one thing, since the SDA's have the SOP to replace the clear teaching of the scriptures, why did they need another source of confusion. (I doubt Col would see it my way.) Oh, one more question, where did Col get the idea that the ten commandments, as written by the finger of God, are now in the Heavenly Sanctuary? Was that bit of enlightenment also given to God's people, the SDA's by their precious SOP? If so, then why are the Jews in Palestine today all excited because they think they have located the manna pot www.vesselofmoses.org ? Wouldn't all of the items contained in the Ark of the Covenant be "carried to heaven" together in the Ark? It appears this simple little pot may not have made the journey. Belva | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 560 Registered: 7-2004 |
Sorry folks, I gave you the wrong link for the manna pot. It should have been www.thevesselofmoses.org I personally don't know what to think of this, but the pot is in very good condition to be as old as it is and to have been unfired. All of the other characteristics of the vessel are identical to those of a vessel used for sacred purpose. Belva | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 564 Registered: 7-2004 |
The following is an excerpt from a statement made by Pastor O'Ffill during a discussion with Colporteur regarding the "Shaking Time" everyone is looking for within the Seventh-day Adventist Church. It almost sounds like they are excited by what they refer to as apostacy... ---------- Make no mistake, the message of the Seventh-day Adventist Church is last day spiritual intelligence and is the message that will keep the saved from being lost when the great deception comes as foretold by Christ. Therefore, this is no time to denounce ourselves or attack ourselves. We wrestle not against flesh and blood but against principalities and powers. There are those among us who are attacking the tenets of our faith. But not to worry. Unless they have a change of mind they will leave us - ì the sinners in Zion will be shaken out.î ---------- I think the Pastor was bristling because someone had made mention of their opinion that there were a lot of leaders within the church who blurring the edges between SDAism and the rest of Christianity. He was making a point about those leaders having been chosen by the laity, so the laity was as responsible for the "falling away" as were the leaders. Also, on another thread over there, talking about "The Clear Word" it is once again Colporteur and Pastor O'Ffill. I guess everybody else was celebrating the 4th, so all they were doing was back and forth discussion between the two of them. I was shocked when the Pastor said that he found the Clear Word to be a blessing. Colporteur made a wise statement when he expressed his wish that The Clear Word had been published as a commentary rather than a paraphrase. Col mentioned that the use of Clear Word put the SDA's in the position of being like the Mormons and being "a people of the book." This truly shows that SDA's themselves can and do perceive the differences about their religion that identify them as a cult. They were concerned about how it made them look. I think that it was Col who mentioned that two Mormon young men had attended his church recently, and he was concerned that the two had felt so welcomed and at home there. I hope I'm not quoting any of this out of context, but I was truly amazed that their discussion kept going on and on the way it did. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2251 Registered: 12-2003 |
Speaking of Mormons feeling comfortable, Richard has had conversations with Mormon students at LLU over the years who really like coming here for professional training because they feel so comfortable. Quite interesting, I think! Colleen |
