| Author | Message | ||
| Marcell Registered user Username: Marcell Post Number: 7 Registered: 4-2004 |
Can any of you share suggestions or ideas that have been effective in witnessing to your SDA family members? I know it's a tricky area, and I want to be as Christ-like as possible, at the same time, I feel they need to hear the straight truth. Challenging, to say the least! I hardly know where to start. | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 717 Registered: 7-2003  |
Marcell, a friend of mine just loaned me Greg Taylor's book, "Discovering the New Covenant: Why I am no Longer an Adventist". I picked it up Friday night and read it in one sitting. It's a smallish book that covers several key topics in a kind and compassionate way. It's quite readable and doesn't require a large time commitment to finish. It seems to be addressed primarily to Adventist who might wonder why someone would ever leave Adventism or to current Adventist who may have a couple of questions of their own. In my opinion, this cook would be a great place to start. If someone asks you why you left, you could give some of your own reasons and offer to give them a short book that helps explain the decision a little more thoroughly from a pastor's perspective. I wish I could get my relatives to read it. Chris | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 718 Registered: 7-2003 |
One other even more basic thing should be stated: TALK ABOUT JESUS! Talk about Jesus all the time. Make Him the center of your speech and actions. Talk about what He's done for you and your family. Talk about how He's changed you. Talk about what Jesus means to you. Talk about your great love and dedication for Jesus. Talk about what Jesus is doing in your life, in your church, in your family, in your community, and at your work. TALK ABOUT JESUS! This more than probably anything else will be a real witness to you SDA family. It may make them uncomfortable, but seeing Jesus at work in your life will speak louder than any information you could give them. Chris | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1685 Registered: 11-2002 |
My SDA kin are one theads width from actually becomming combative at the idea that someone who once was SDA can acually be attending a different church. Well, if it is a different Sabbath observing church they are not quite as vile in their verbal tirades but if it is a church that meets on Sunday then it is not a lovely scene to be around when the issue comes up in conversation. My first and formost method of wittnessing is to try to live my convictions. After that, I use the term "Christian" frequently in coversation. For instance, we have one local cop who has delt with my family a lot who is very nice. He is a considerate and decent person. This is in contrast to most of the local cops who are very unkind, mean, power hungry people who'd just as soon beat the person up as to look at them. I mentioned to my mom that Officer L. must be Christian because whenever he's called out to my house he behaves with decency and kindness, yet gets the job as cop done that he needs to do. I use the terms, "Jesus" and "Holy Spirit" in my conversation whenever it is approiate. Once several years ago my mom set me up. Yep, she set me up. She said to me, "You seem to really like going to that Lutheran church. How come you have never invited me to come along with you?" I got all happy and said, "I'd love to have you come with me sometime. I think you'd really like it. When do you want to come with me?" She looked me stright in the eye and said, "I will not be coming with you to church. Thanks for inviting me but you should know by now that I will not go to a Sunday-keeping church." To say the least, that really kind-of got under my fingernails, if you know what I mean. I just kept thinking, "Dang, she set me up and I fell for it." Dennis, what do you think of that one?! | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1591 Registered: 12-2003  |
Marcell, I completely agree with Chris. We've not found an effective way to talk to our Adentist family. Unless they really want to understand, they will either argue or rationalize or just get quiet. Talking about Jesus in your life is the one thing you can do which they cannot argue. (They can say that the blessings you're experiencing might have come from Satan--we've gotten that answer--but they can't really explain away your experience.) Be ready to answer questions, but don't feel you must get them to understand. You can't. Jesus can. Greg's book is also very good--if they'll read it, it's probably a good "explanation" of how you have come to understand the New Covenant and the Bible. We have some SDA relatives who really see pretty close to the way we see things, but because of family ties and risks, they don't engage much in conversations about spiritual things anymore. To act on what the head believes would require risking great losses. I'm thankful God knows our hearts, and He keeps His own safe. Colleen | ||
| Tracey Registered user Username: Tracey Post Number: 257 Registered: 9-2004 |
As you know, I love someone that is in that church and it's been 1.5 years now. Since I *really* learned about SDA, in Sept. 2004, I have talked Jesus! It's working b/c the person I love, prays in "Jesus" name, Begins prayers with "Lord Jesus, we thank you.." and stuff like that. He refers to the Holy Spirit leading him now and I see him being different than before. I have learned that Jesus is all I need. | ||
| Tdf Registered user Username: Tdf Post Number: 54 Registered: 11-2004 |
Marcell, Boy can I relate to your question. My wife and I spent months prayerfully composing a kind and polite letter to our family and friends that explains why we aren't attending in an SDA church. We finally sent the letter a couple of months ago and the response has been intense (and pretty hurtful). I can't read the hearts and minds of those who are responding to us, but it appears to me that the folks who received our letter are simply not open to what we have to say (rather, our attempts to dialogue with them only make them furious). In retrospect, I wish that we had simply written them a short letter letting them know how much we love them and that, for doctrinal reasons, we can no longer attend the SDA church. The personal attacks have become exhausting and it appears that the dialogue is not benefitting anyone (although God may know things that we don't know). I know that it's wrong to generalize, but it seems that many SDAs view the following statement as a personal attack, "I do not believe that Ellen White is a prophet of God." Rather than accepting this as a statement that can be debated, it is viewed as a vicious attempt to malign the very bedrock on which SDAs stand. Maybe that's not true for everyone--that has certainly been my experience. With that being the case, it's very difficult to dialogue with my family. No matter how kind and how polite I am, I feel like I am trying to pet rabid dogs who are protecting their newborn pups. For now, I've told my parents that I'm not interested in any further debate. If I don't bring an end to the cycle that we're in right now, we may not be able to salvage a relationship of any kind (and I'd really hate to see that happen). Marcell, my heart reaches out to you for I am personally involved in asking the same questions that you're asking. No matter how you handle the situation, it's difficult. Pray without ceasing! That's what we're doing these days. tdf | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1595 Registered: 12-2003 |
Again, tdf, I so empathize with your situation. Unfortunately, it seems to be all too common. Ask God to give you opportunities and words to speak; pray and talk about Jesus; beyond that--we often have to be content with fairly superficial relationships with our loved ones. We always hope that as we mature, we can have strong, supportive, understanding adult relationships with our parents and siblings. Not everyone, however, desires to grow in knowing truth and reality. I have greatly beloved people in my life that I feel oddly estranged from simply because they don't want me to talk about Jesus or because they don't want to examine what is REAL or truthful. To some, integrity means doing what they think they want to do based on their personal evaluation and simply ignoring what outside evidence or other's observations might suggest. It really is quite disappointing, and there's a definite experience of loss. The miracle is that God brings people into our lives that support and love us because they first have surrendered to whatever Jesus has for them. In Christ relationships are completely different than they are otherwise. Colleen | ||
| Bob Registered user Username: Bob Post Number: 127 Registered: 7-2000  |
I second the good counsel that all of the others have given above. I repeat what I said in an earlier post: people can only anger and frustrate you to the degree that you still have expectations of them. When I was personally dealing with this kind of situation, the Lord showed me the extent to which I had not yet truly "grown up and left" my parental-extended family, emotionally and psychologically. If I still allowed them to walk on my feelings and intimidate me, it revealed my own need for a greater sense of emotional independence and healthy separation from them. Remember how threatened you were when you began to learn the real facts about SDA doctrine? Well, your parents often feel a greater threat, because they have invested many more years of their lives in Adventism than you have. Your disaffection from Adventism represents to them a challenge to the very meaning of their lives! | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 345 Registered: 6-2004 |
How would you counter the statement, "If you loved Jesus, you would keep his commandments...including the sabbath"? | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 798 Registered: 7-2003  |
Jesus never commanded anyone to keep the sabbath in any written teaching we have. | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 130 Registered: 8-2004 |
Perhaps by looking at the places Jesus says "and this is my commandment . . ."? I've found that helpful myself anyway. helovesme2 | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 447 Registered: 10-2004  |
Here is something which I typed up before, but hadn't posted yet: The SDAs love to quote Jesus saying, "If ye love Me, keep My commandments." (John 14:15) Of course, they say this means the Ten Commandments. But the Bible never even says "the Ten Commandments"! The Hebrew word for "commandments" used in the English translation "the Ten Commandments" (which phrase occurs in 3 places in the Bible) is dabar and simply means, "words." It does not mean "commandments." The translation should be "the Ten Words." Therefore, "God's commandments" or "the commandments of God" or "the commandments" or "My commandments" would never have meant to any Jew, "the Ten Commandments." If it meant the Law--it would have meant the whole Law. But they would not have referred to the Ten as "the commandments ("entole")." If they were to refer to the Ten, they probably would have said "the Ten Words," which is what the Torah calls them. So there is just no way Jesus meant the Ten Commandments when He said, "My commandements." The Greek word is entole, and that word is NOT used in the Septuagint (the Greek translation of the OT) in any of the 3 passages that say "the Ten Commandments (or "Words")"! The Greek words used are rhema and logos. When Jesus told the rich young ruler, "keep the commandments," the man asked, "Which?" Jesus then quoted commandments out of the Decalogue AND Leviticus. Jeremy | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1604 Registered: 12-2003 |
The difference between entole, as Jeremy points out, and the word for law (nomos) is what helped me originally see this distinction. Entole does not mean "law" or "Ten Commandments". It means "teachings" or "sayings" or "commands". Nomos is the word used to refer to "law"--and it meant the whole Torah. Helovesme had a great suggestion--have them look at the verses where Jesus identifies His commandments! Colleen | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 346 Registered: 6-2004 |
Jeremy to the rescue again. Thanks. It's true, I read that SDA baloney all the time on another forum about Jesus and keeping his commandments. It's so annoying to hear the SDA's tie sabbath requirements into that statement. | ||
| Tealeaves Registered user Username: Tealeaves Post Number: 224 Registered: 5-2004 |
I have to second the "talk about Jesus" advice. this is what I did when I met my husband. He was dyed in the wool conservative SDA. He had no comfort level with my talking about Jesus, but it must have piqued his interest, because he stuck around, and 4 years later we got married and he was on his journey to leaving the SDA church. Because of the closeness between us, we were able to touch the subject of Adventist beliefs. (which was very tense and sticky for a long long time.) What is hard to know is how to talk to his parents about it. They tend to be very closed in general, especially about any subject that could bring about conflict. So though they know we are not SDA, they don't talk to us about it. Sometimes I wonder whether we should be more forward about it. But right now we just talk to them about Jesus, and about where God is leading us and how blessed we are. Perhaps we should be saying more?? I don't know. -tanya- | ||
| Tracey Registered user Username: Tracey Post Number: 273 Registered: 9-2004 |
This is also where part of my and C's studies are... We are reading various sources from the original Hebrew bible translated into english. Most of these books are from like the Center from Judaic Studies etc who totally skip even the Greek versions and translate from Hebrew to english. They say a major problem of the KJV is that it is a translation of a translation (meaning an english version from a greek). The best way to understand the bible is from Hebrew (aramaic) to english and that translator can give a better, clearer interpretation of words and ideas as they were intended. Tracey | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1216 Registered: 3-2004  |
My parents are dead, and they died as SDA. All my brothers and sisters have not been to an SDA church for years, but 3 of the sisters still hang onto SDA beliefs. The other sister does not and my three younger brothers do not. With the oldest sister, she is angry at Christianity because of the example my Mom, her step Mom set and the way my Mom treated her and her brother. I can talk about the things I learn to 2 of my brothers, and some things to my oldest sister(my half sister) but to the rest of the family, I have to be careful. So I just talk about what God has done, is doing for me and how much I love him. And I pray for my sisters and brothers. One day each of them will accept Christ and that is what I pray for. Oh, When my Mom died, I asked my oldest sister to be the holder of the family prayer list and she said yes. So when my son goes over seas, I call her and he gets put on the top of her prayer list. When I needed a job, I was put on the prayer list. So, God is working on the heart of each of my sisters. Thank You God. You are awesome. Diana | ||
| Tracey Registered user Username: Tracey Post Number: 277 Registered: 9-2004 |
What a neat idea, a Family Prayer List! wow.. How did that begin? Tracey | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1218 Registered: 3-2004 |
Tracey, My Mom, when she was alive, had a prayer list and put all her children, grandchildren and any other concerns on it. When she died an older sister(I have 3 older sisters, my half sister and two sisters before me) found a number of her prayer lists. My half sister, is the oldest sister. My mom was not nice to her and her brother as children or adults. But when Mom died, I called this sister, with whom I get along very well, and told her that since she is the eldest child would she be the holder of the family prayer list. She agreed. The idea behind this is that whenever any one of us needs prayer for anything we ask this sister to pray. I think I am the only one, in reality that asks her for prayer. I do it for many reasons. I love her dearly and I do know what my Mom did to her and her brother. If it had happened today, it would be called child abuse. I also like to let her know what God is doing for me and how He is answering her prayers. She likes it when I tell her how God answers her prayers. I am the only one in the family that she will tell about what Mom did to her. So I pray and ask God to keep the lines of communication open with this sister and myself. God has been awesome about this and this sister and I can talk about anything. She does not go to any church and is really angry at God and Christianity, especially the SDA church for the way my Mom treated her. Being her friend, as well as her sister, she has used me to process many things and she is healing. I thank God I have been able to help her in the process. So that is how the family prayer list began. My Mom's death opened the door way even more to my oldest sister's heart and I am so happy I was there to enter. God has been good and will continue to be so. One day my sister will let God enter her heart. Of that I am certain. He is awesome. Diana |
