| Author | Message | ||
| Patti |
For years, as a child growing up SDA, I was intimidated by those I heard speak of their Christian "witness." I wanted to witness also, but, even then, I was astute enough to realize I had nothing to say. The Lord had not "delivered" me from any major sin, such as smoking, drinking, illegal drugs. And while I led a pretty moral life, even by SDA standards, I knew that there was nothing inside of me that I was comfortable about putting up for exhibition for the entire world to scrutinize and then stand in wonder at. In short, I had no witness, and I was jealous of those who did. As I grew older, this feeling stayed with me. I did not stray from the "church," so I had no tear-evoking story of prodigalism to share. I began to make more serious mistakes, but still not outside the boundaries of acceptable SDA society. Then the Gospel found me. I did not find it; I was not looking for it. The Holy Spirit revealed to me a righteousness beyond compare that was mine simply because Christ chose to reveal Himself to me. I found myself blessed with a witness so powerful, so consuming, that, not only did I have something to witness to, I found that I could not stop talking about it. The funny thing is that my religious peers were not at all interested in what I had to say. They became bored very easily whenever I tried to talk about the all-sufficient work of Jesus Christ on our behalf. Their attitude was one of boredom and impatience: Yes, we all know that Jesus died for our sins, but... And then they would go on and outline all the wonderful things inside of them that they had to "witness" to. I was confused, troubled, saddened. How can people bearing the name of Christ become bored or impatient with constant reminders and repetitions of the Gospel of salvation in Jesus Christ? What, I wondered, are they expecting to experience greater than being saved to the uttermost? I drifted away from SDA fellowship seeking out other like-minded Gospel-oriented believers. I would like to tell you that I found in "Babylon" hoards of Spirit-filled witnesses to the all-sufficient work of Jesus Christ in our behalf. However, that was not the case. Although there have been pockets of individuals that I have encountered that have a Spirit-filled and Christ-centered theology, I have found that most of Christendom (in my limited experience) is tainted with the cancer of believer-centricity. For most of Christendom, Christianity is not about what Christ HAS DONE for all who believe in Him; it is instead about what He CAN DO IN THEM. No matter how one tries to say that pointing to the "Christ inside" is being Christ-centered, the fact remains that the person who so preaches is directing the focus to his own personal "righteousness." His witness is the same as I heard all my life in the SDA church--not the unchangeable, historic, objective reality of the marvelous saving act of Jesus Christ for all humanity, but a shallow, narrow, tunnel-visioned, egocentric grabbing of attention away from the cross and focusing it upon one's own filthy rags righteousness. As I studied, the more I became convinced that modern Christianity is selling a bill of bogus goods to the world. It is legalism in its most insidious form because it is not blatant like medieval Catholicism. It is sly and cunning; it preys on the human ego. It is the echoing down the millenia of the serpent's tantalizing and hypnotizing words: "You will be as God." There is ample evidence of the True Witness in the Scriptures, but Christendom as a whole turns a blind eye to it. The Acts of the Apostles is full of examples of Christian witness. These men and women were filled to overflowing with the Holy Spirit, and they witnessed boldly. Just exactly what was their witness? Acts 2:14 Then Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice and addressed the crowd: "Fellow Jews and all of you who live in Jerusalem, let me explain this to you; listen carefully to what I say. 15 These men are not drunk, as you suppose. It's only nine in the morning! 16 No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel: 17 "In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. 18 Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy. 21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.' 22 "Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. 23 This man was handed over to you by God's set purpose and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. 24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him. 32 God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all witnesses of the fact. 33 Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. 36 "Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ." The witness of the disciples on the Day of Pentecost is the first and prime example of the True Witness. Peter says that this was the prophesied outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Did these people stand and testify to their changed lives or regenerated character? Absolutely not. Their witness was to Jesus Christ, crucified, dead, and risen. To be continued.... | ||
| Patti |
Let's look for more witnessing in Acts. We don't have far to go: Acts 3:11 While the beggar held on to Peter and John, all the people were astonished and came running to them in the place called Solomon's Colonnade. 12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: "Men of Israel, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk? 13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go. 14 You disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you. 15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this. Again, the True Witness is to the dead and risen Savior, Jesus Christ. Acts 4:5 The next day the rulers, elders and teachers of the law met in Jerusalem. 6 Annas the high priest was there, and so were Caiaphas, John, Alexander and the other men of the high priest's family. 7 They had Peter and John brought before them and began to question them: "By what power or what name did you do this?" 8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them: "Rulers and elders of the people! 9 If we are being called to account today for an act of kindness shown to a cripple and are asked how he was healed, 10 then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. 11 He is "the stone you builders rejected, which has become the capstone. 12 Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved." Again, we have an incident of someone (Peter) being filled with the Holy Spirit. What was the result of this infilling of the Spirit? A personal testimony of a changed life? Hardly! The result was a witness to the death and resurrection of our Lord and Savior. Later in this chapter we find a prayer of the disciples. Was this prayer for help to conquer their sinful flesh? Read for yourself: 29 Now, Lord, consider their threats and enable your servants to speak your word with great boldness. 30 Stretch out your hand to heal and perform miraculous signs and wonders through the name of your holy servant Jesus." 31 After they prayed, the place where they were meeting was shaken. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and spoke the word of God boldly. It was a prayer for the empowerment of the Holy Spirit to speak the word of God, the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, boldly. Continuing: 32 All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they had. And what was the great uniting force? Their regenerated characters? Again, the answer is no. The uniting force was the driving compulsion to tell a dying world about its redemption in Jesus Christ: 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and much grace was upon them all. I don't think I need to spoonfeed you the rest of the book of Acts. You know where to find it, and if you are impelled by the Holy Spirit, you will study it out for yourself. The True Witness is to the historic Jesus Christ, His life, death and resurrection. It is not to ANYTHING that happens in the believer. What happens in us is subjective, it varies from believer to believer, it changed from day to day, it is unstable and unfinished and uncertain. The Gospel, our True Witness, is none of the above. It is concrete, finished, objective. It means the same to all who will believe: everlasting life and reconciliation with God. One final text that sums it all up for me: 1 John 5:6 This is the one who came by water and blood--Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who testifies, because the Spirit is the truth. 7 For there are three that testify: 8 the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement. 9 We accept man's testimony, but God's testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son. 10 Anyone who believes in the Son of God has this testimony in his heart. Anyone who does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because he has not believed the testimony God has given about his Son. 11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. There is only one True Witness: Jesus Christ and Him crucified. All else is filthy rags indeed. May God truly bless you this day and lead us all into a deeper appreciation and understanding of the wonder of the gift of salvation that God freely provides to us for the sake of His Son, our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ the holy. Patti | ||
| Max |
Dear Patti, Thank you for your personal testimony. As I read it I found myself agreeing with nearly everything. I'd like to comment on one passage: ^^The True Witness is to the historic Jesus Christ, His life, death and resurrection. It is not to ANYTHING that happens in the believer.^^ I would only say that what happens in the believer IS the witness, "filthy rags" though it may be. "By their fruits shall ye know them." It's not that we witness to what happens inside us. It's what's inside us that witnesses by our fruits to the transforming power of "Christ IN you the hope of glory." God bless always, MC | ||
| Patti |
It is not my personal testimony, Max. It is my lack of personal testimony. There is only one True Witness, Jesus Christ, crucified and risen. PS You do know, don't you, that many biblical authorities claim that that verse should actually read, "Christ among you (as in "Emmanuel, God with us"), the hope of glory." | ||
| Max |
^^There is only one True Witness, Jesus Christ, crucified and risen.^^ Matthew 10:18On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as WITNESSES to them and to the Gentiles. Mark 13:9"You must be on your guard. You will be handed over to the local councils and flogged in the synagogues. On account of me you will stand before governors and kings as WITNESSES to them. Luke 24:48You are WITNESSES of these things. Acts 1:8But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my WITNESSES in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth." Acts 2:32God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all WITNESSES of the fact. Acts 3:15You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are WITNESSES of this. Acts 5:32We are WITNESSES of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him." Acts 10:39 "We are WITNESSES of everything he [Jesus Christ] did in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They killed him by hanging him on a tree... Acts 10:41He was not seen by all the people, but by WITNESSES whom God had already chosen--by us who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. Acts 13:31...for many days he [Jesus Christ] was seen by those who had traveled with him from Galilee to Jerusalem. They are now his WITNESSES to our people. 1 Thessalonians 2:101 You are WITNESSES, and so is God, of how holy, righteous and blameless we were among you who believed. 1 Timothy 6:121 Fight the good fight of the faith. Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many WITNESSES. Hebrews 12:1Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of [Old Testament] WITNESSES, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us. | ||
| Max |
To all: The saved person does not say to others, "Look at me! See my transformed life!" Rather, the transformed life itself is the testimony to others of Christ's obedience within. Max of the Cross | ||
| Rayna |
"For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, tha he is a debtor to do the whole law:" "Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace." "For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith." Galatians 5:3-5 | ||
| Patti |
Max wrote: ^^There is only one True Witness, Jesus Christ, crucified and risen.^^ Matthew 10:18 On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as WITNESSES to them and to the Gentiles. etc..... Thank you! You gave even more support for my point. Our witness is NEVER what happens in us; it is the testimony of the crucified and risen Savior. | ||
| Max |
^^Our witness is NEVER what happens in us; it is the testimony of the crucified and risen Savior.^^ What happens in us -- transformed lives -- is our witness to the world in words and deeds. | ||
| Max |
Patti, always happy to support your points whenever and wherever they can be supported with Scripture alone. -MC | ||
| Patti |
What happens in us -- transformed lives -- is our witness to the world in words and deeds. Are you offering your life as a witness to the world? Will it stand the relentless, demanding scrutiny of all of the law of God? Mine won't. I am now, will always be dependent upon the mercy (grace) of God in forgiving me. I have nothing to boast of in my life, nothing I care to display to the world. A couple of more points: 1. What happens to your "testimony" when you fall, as you surely will, seeing as you are still human? Your testimony falls also. Because it has been built upon the sand. The only True Testimony is the righteousness of Jesus Christ, extrinsic to us, imputed to all who believe. 2. You still have not addressed the fact that in the New Testament, the being filled with the Holy Spirit ALWAYS resulted in that person witnessing to the dead and risen Christ. Not a single time does it say that the Spirit-filled person experienced character regeneration. When the Holy Spirit is poured out upon us, we witness to the worthiness of the Lamb of God. This is the only True Witness. Grace and peace, Patti | ||
| Denisegilmore |
If my life were held up as a witness, what a tradegy that would be to God! I tell others of Jesus and what He has done for us as this has been the only thing in my mind these days. It is breaking my heart to see others not want to hear the good news. If I didn't have that good news in my heart, I'd shoot myself right now. It is the ONLY hope I have. This is just where I'm at. Oh, I get a few glimpses of relief, sometimes while sleeping or other such things that require little thinking. I'm at the Mercy of God and to this I will proclaim this good news to all. Even while feeling an extreme amount of depression for whatever reason. My hope is in my Lord Jesus Christ. Someone, pray for me. D--this is a time that I wished my name was not on these posts. | ||
| Max |
^^Help thou mine unbelief.^^ There is only one way to help unbelief. As Bonhoeffer has written, ^^Only the obedient believe. If we are to believe, we must obey a concrete command. Without this preliminary step of obedience, our faith will only be pious humbug, and lead us to the grace which is not costly. Everything depends on the first step. It has a unique quality of its own. The first step of obedience makes Peter leave his nets and later get out of the ship [to walk on water at his Lord's invitation]; it calls upon the young man [rich young ruler] to leave his riches. Only this new existence, created through obedience, can make faith possible.^^ Max of the Cross | ||
| Max |
^^For most of Christendom, Christianity is not about what Christ HAS DONE for all who believe in Him; it is instead about what He CAN DO IN THEM.^^ Only "what Christ HAS DONE for all who believe in Him" makes possible "what He CAN DO IN THEM." As Bonhoeffer has written, ^^It is only the call of Jesus which makes it [distinguishing faith from faithlessness] a situation where faith is possible. ... Discipleship is not an offer man makes to Christ. It is only the call which creates the situation [where faith is even possible]. ... It is only through the call [of Jesus] that it receives its justification. ...the situation in which faith is possible is itself only rendered possible through faith. ... ONLY HE WHO BELIEVES IS OBEDIENT, AND ONLY HE WHO IS OBEDIENT BELIEVES.^^ (Emphasis Bonhoeffer's.) Only when one obeys -- as Peter did when he left his nets, when he climbed out of the boat and walked on water, and when he left Pilate's cursing courtroom after the rooster crowed and went out and "wept bitterly" -- does one become a believer. And only when one believes can one obey. The two are two sides of the same coin. And that coin is Christ. Max of the Cross | ||
| Max |
^^Yes, we all know that Jesus died for our sins, but...^^ Not "but," Patti, THEREFORE. ^^Therefore, brothers, we have an OBLIGATION -- but it is NOT to the sinful nature, to live according to it. For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship.^^ --Paul, NIV Romans 8:12-15. Max of the Cross | ||
| Max |
^^And then they would go on and outline all the wonderful things inside of them that they had to "witness" to. I was confused, troubled, saddened.^^ I would not have been "confused, troubled, saddened" for them. Rather I would have been encouraged, even elated, in the words of Paul: ^^You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, IF the Spirit of God lives IN you. And if anyone does NOT have the Spirit of Christ, he does NOT belong to Christ. But if Christ is IN you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living IN you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives IN you." NIV Romans 8:9-11. | ||
| Maryann |
Hi All, Would this be a sound Biblical statement?: Our charater, our changed life, the fruits of the Spirit that the Spirit demonstrates though us in our obedience to the promptings of the Spirit; demonstrate to those around us, CREDENCE to the fact that our Savior provided for us, SALVATION BY GRACE ALONE. I remember when I first, "got saved." (About 1995) The "sinner's prayer" was pushed on me for several hours by several ladies before I finally gave in to THEIR pressure. It was a shallow, selfish, to benifit me "get saved" prayer proceedure. From the way that salvation by grace was presented to me by THESE PEOPLE, it seemed to me a sure fire way to "let God" save me, and me continue on in my same ugly life style. Armed with my "new" salvation under arm, I went to work and bragged about how easy and cool it was to "get saved!!" I mentioned it to a few of my now, "unsaved buddies" and suggested that they too should try it. After several of my buddies told me that Christians didn't act like I was acting, I shut my mouth and was very happy to go to another job and forget the whole "saved" thing. During this time, I was witnessed to by some wonderful Christian guys at work. They pointed to Christ as their sole salvation and gave me verses and so on. I asked them about their lives and how long they had been Christians. One guy, Kenny, was particularly interesting to me as the life he described a few years earlier was very similar to mine. Kenny radiated JOY. He radiated Christ with out even opening his mouth. So did a guy named Ralph and many others. The lives that Kenny and Ralph lived and the loving and non-critical witness they gave to me when I asked them about Christ and what he did for them both in salvation and in their personal live was the SEED that was planted in my heart!! PRAISE GOD FOR THE JOY AND CHRISTLIKENESS THAT RADIATED FROM KENNY AND RALPH'S LIVES. I am sooooooooooo ashamed of the horrible witness I gave to those at work that I told I was saved!!!!;,,,,-(( When I was only using "saved" as a way to continue to live an UN-CHRISTLIKE lifestyle!!!! Since the seeds that Kenny and Ralph got watered over the next few years and various incidents have happened, I was "saved" in about 1998. It was not like the first time I prayed the sinner's prayed from my head while being pushed into it, it was quietly, alone and from my heart. Sure, I have my ups and downs (and I'm down right now) as I'm sure most of you do. The difference now is that I have a peace that I never had before and the burning desire to serve Christ and share with as many as possible, the wonderful news of SALVATION BY GRACE ALONE! Again, praise God for the witness of Kenny and Ralph and the "credence" their actions gave to the fact that they had given their lives wholly and completely over to Christ. Emotionally flat from 1 week of being with one of my best friends that believes and practices "continued" justification to a "T" by his deeds......Maryann | ||
| Max |
Patti, ^^What happens in us -- transformed lives -- is our witness to the world in words and deeds. Are you offering your life as a witness to the world?^^ As Christ's sheep I have already responded to his call to follow him. Therefore my following is my testimony. I don't say, "Hey everybody! Look at me following Christ!" I just follow. When others see my "following testimony" and start to follow as well, they don't follow me. They follow Christ. | ||
| Max |
Patti, ^^Are you offering your life as a witness to the world? Will it stand the relentless, demanding scrutiny of all of the law of God? Mine won't. I am now, will always be dependent upon the mercy (grace) of God in forgiving me. I have nothing to boast of in my life, nothing I care to display to the world.^^ Will my life-witness "stand the relentless, demanding scrutiny of all of the law of God?" It doesn't have to. I'm wearing the robe of Christ's righteousness, not my own "filthy rags" robe. | ||
| Maryann |
Hi Max, Well said: "I don't say, "Hey everybody! Look at me following Christ!" I just follow. When others see my "following testimony" and start to follow as well, they don't follow me. They follow Christ." Maryann |
