| Author | Message | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
I have recently left the church after 27 years of bondage. It has been scarey and lonely. I have been reading over the forum and wow it is amazing we all are the same and have the same issues. I have read about anger and I am at that point now sadness depression etc. It has been a wide range of emotuins. I have had to deal with explaining this new way of life to my 12 year old. There are so many things that I have had to feel and go through all the old SDA tapes in my head etc. One thing that I read in one forum was amazing I also feel I have a different understanding of the Gospel then even other christians now. I feel like my relationship with Christ is so different it is not about attending or being involved in church it is about me and Christ. I am not saying we do not need church but it is just different now. The SDA church was so based on your life in church. I would love to correspond with any former SDA and share experiences. tbawgus@hotmail.com | ||
| Janet (Janet) |
Welcome TerryK! You have found the place where we all can relate,in one way or the other. I will be praying for you as you continue in your relationship with Jesus. As I have said before, and heard others say, reading the Bible has taken on a whole new meaning! Praise God for His Truth which sets us free! God Bless You, Janet | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Hi, Terry. I just joined this discussion group last week. Does your child attend a SDA school? Do you have a Christian support system? I attend an awsome Christian church, a ELCA Lutheran church here locally. Sadly, the sda's who I love the most have told me it would be better to have no church affiliation than to go to a sunday-keeping church. Never mnd that the sda church has plenty of church meetings on Sundays. This I know because I attended sda schools. At Monterey Bay Academy we had church in the main church on Sunday evenings. We had chapel in the dorms in the mornings. During week ofprayer we had church on Sundays. The Revolation Seminars always have Sunday meetings. The summer camp have church on Sundays. I could go on and on but you get my point. The sda's say one thing and practice another. There is a Lutheran church that has a Saturday afternoon service. It's the same exact service as they give on Sundays. When I tell SDA family that I frequently attend this service at the Lutheran church I'm told that before God that doesn't count. Why? Because Lutherans "don't KEEP the Sabbath". Get real! Yeah, Terry, it's a constant challange. Prayer and faith will get you through. And, friends and a social group will help a lot, too. Again, welcome. Susan | ||
| Denisegilmore (Denisegilmore) |
Welcome Terry, While I was never a "member" of the SDA church, I attended it (and others), all during childhood and teen years. Then spent 100s of years away from any church.....well, okay, about 20+. In 1999, my attendance was back to the SDA (because of the Sabbath, of course and I couldn't find a Synogague near me) and it was amazing how quickly things came back to me. But being older and having read the Bible (had never done that) for 3-4 months prior to attending any church, I also quickly heard many things that I'd approach the pastor about. Never did get an answer to my many questions. I was refused baptism. I left about 2 years ago. BUT....you are not alone with those old tapes! Probably most all here understand that one. They get less and less noisy as times goes by, this has been my experience anyway. I resigned to only know what the Bible, God's Word, had to say, even the more. And 2 years later, I'm content not attending nor being affiliated with any denomination. I am part of the body of Christ already and therefore part of the CHURCH. For me, what really helps, is reading the Bible ONLY. I always pray first that God will lead me through whatever He wants me to know. Seems to work out nicely. Infact, it's wonderful for me as I'm not swayed by any denominational belief this way so I have no bias one way or another. Things are much more clear and getting more and more clear as time passes. Now, there are those times when I could really use a good Christian friend to speak with regarding the things of God and try as I might, it didn't come my way as I wanted and yearned for. But God in His Wisdom put me next door to a very nice Christian man and we speak of God quite often. And believe it or not, at first he was one of those guys that believed and told me that women should remain silent when it comes to things of God! Now, he is the one tapping on my door offering icecream or a donut, and I always know that he has some question that he's leading up to regarding Scripture. This is funny. He is my senior by 30 years and asking me for answers! Not that I have all the answers for most certainly I do not, but I'll sure try to find them for the both of us when this happens. So, this is one way that God gave me fellowship. Another way is with my inhome care lady. She's turns out to be a devout Christian woman and we speak of God all the while she is here, and that is 4 days of the week fellowship with her alone! So that's 2 people. Of course I thanked God alot for all this. But He didn't stop there! No, this nurse calls me to tell me that she wants to be my private nurse for free! I was rather shocked and skeptical, I might add. When she gets here, she is an on fire for Jesus Ordained Minister/Nurse! So that is 3 people not counting all kinds of folks from this building who come here with questions about God. I'm amazed before my very eyes to see so many take hold of the Gospel! I've seen grown men start crying when they hear this Glorious Gospel. So, Terry, trust God for He said that He will NEVER LEAVE YOU NOR FORSAKE YOU. And God does not lie.  Do not be afraid. This is a great journey you have just begun! My prayers to you and your household will go unceasing to God, in your behalf. your sister in Jesus the Christ, denise | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
Thank you all so much for your support I need it. It was very hard to leave the church family behind . They lie and say we can be friends but I know they think I am going to Hell and I think they are mislead so I have cut most of my ties to friends. Its funny after you think of it all you had in common was the Sabbath anyway. I am so glad I found or God showed me this site. These are things only someone else who has had this nonsense told to them for so long can relate to. I also praise God everyday for showing me his Grace My theme song for a long time was by John Tesh and someone else. one of the verses said I sorry Lord for all that I hjve made it its all about you Lord all about you. Thanks again keep in touch Terry | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
Welcome, Terry. I'm glad to see you here! The anger and depression are inevitable parts of leaving. I remember feeling like I was losing myself. Richard remembers more anger than depression; I remember him saying he wished he could get back all the tithe he paid! You're also right about the continuing friendships. I believe they mean well when they say they can continue to be friends, and a few, I think, do. Most Adventists, however, really are uncomfortable sustaining a friendship with a person who has left the church and found Jesus. I think the reason it's so hard to continue is that when a person finds Jesus and is truly born again, reality is different. I've found that where formerly I had much to talk about with certain people, now there are uncomfortable silences because they can't talk about what has become the center of my life: Jesus and the way he is affecting my life. It's hard to have ongoing, transparent conversation with someone who doesn't want to talk about what's happening in your life! And I'm sure the Adventists feel the same way on their side of the conversation. Suddenly we have new interests (including Bible study,of all things!) that actually fill our minds. Reality is different. I'm sorry for the pain you're experiencing, Terry, but Jesus is the heart healer. Tell us where you 12-yr.old goes to school, etc. How is he/she reacting to your changes? Does he like your new church? Praise God he put you in a fellowship where you can grow in him! We're praying for you! Colleen | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
Thanks again. My daughter who is 12 and son is seven. I think they like the new found freedom. My son and husband are very into sports which according to sister White is evil so it has opened up many things for them God was gracious in my ignorance and we did find some things he could participate but not many. My daughter is a little harder for explaining why I now were a wedding band after 14 years etc. We are all coping it has even been hard for my husband who never believed in the church as I did to see such a change in me I think he thought I was losing my mind. It has been hard on my daughter and myself we are alike when it comes to having friends and that has been a hard thing to go to a church where everyone does not know who you are or what your story is. God is good he will see us through he brought us this far which if you look at yourself just getting to see the light in the SDA church is a miricle. I used to talk religion for so many years I thought I knew so much then I started reading new testiment with new nonadventist eyes and I was really just a babe God has showed me so many things it has been wonderful too. My kids are hard of hearing and they attend deaf schools so we did not have the SDA school issues. Please keep us in your prayers and pray that Stephanie will make some friends in our new church. Terry | ||
| Janet (Janet) |
HI Terry, I am attending a non-denominational church, and have found so many wonderful friends there. As I have been developing these relationships, I am so amazed at the fact that it feels like Ive known them for years. We all have so much in common, and share Jesus with each other, and just really enjoy the "freedom" in Christ. This forum has also been a great source of friendship for me! I love going to church, and not worrying about what someone may or may not be wearing, and about how someone may or may not smell, and keeping count of all who attend and study their Quarterly,...then after church, wondering at the potluck, what had meat in it... :-) I love going to a church, where the focus is on "getting people saved!" Terry, you have tons of friends you havent met yet, just don't give up. We are all here for you too. I will be praying God leads in your new relationships. And for your daughters also. May God bless you, Janet | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
We have attended some nondenominational church. My experience is sometimes I think that not all but some of those are too focused on being different to extreme. I am not ready to come in cutsoffs and start dancing around yet these are what the ones that we visited. I still have the thing about wearing my best for God and reverence. We are attending a Baptist church right now. I do know that I will never look at church the same way as the past. My salvation does not rest on the church I attend and no one but God is going to convict me or make me feel the guilt that we all are too fimilar with. Even in sunday churches I see people running around being so busy in church that I feel they think that is their experience with christianity. Well enough of my soap box. Terry | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Yes. I don't much care for the apparent chaos of the worship styles in some churches. I much prefer a formal worship style. I very much prefer a church that follows a literagical form of worship. From the beginning I felt very compatable in the Lutheran, as I susspect I would in the Prespertarian, Episplication, Catholic or Orthodox churches, too. However, from what I know about Christian doctrine and prctices I prefer the Lutheran and most likly would the Prespertarian, too. These denominations leave nothing to guesswork. They lay it all out for you when you go through the Catachism class. During the service, except for the sermon, every word said it in the bulliton or the worship book before you. And, I especially like where I go at th Lutheran because every service there is three long passages read directly from the Bible. All the blessings come right from Bible passages. Every service has the congreation reciting the Our Father in unison. It is Bible all the way and it's so refreshing. | ||
| Lydell (Lydell) |
Wow, we are all so different. Susan, I'm uncomfortable in the very kind of service you like. To me that style would be stifling. The church I attend is nondenominational (a part of the Vineyard association of churches). Everything is soundly scripturally based also. Yet our style of service is very much non-traditional. Instead of piano and organ, we have drums, guitars, keyboard, and currently a flute and saxophone. The music is contemporary songs, with very few traditional hymns. I like that the service is not printed out, because that means that the worship leader and pastor are listening to the Lord and willing to make any changes that He may prompt (for instance, occasionally the leader will stop the music and we will all just wait on the Lord and worship silently, or the pastor may suddenly feel prompted to add something, a scripture or a thought that has just come to mind during his sermon. Often it is those very changes that are the ones that most powerfully affected a particular individual in that service.) Those changes are always fascinating to me because there is a real unity of the people in the flow of things, folks will say later that they were just wanting to worship silently when the change was made, or when the change was made to an enthusiastic praise song, they were just feeling their own desire to do that. Hm, so where was I going with this? Oh yeah, so Terry, just keep looking and stay open to how the Lord leads you. I never would have thought before attending our church that this was the style of worship that would appeal to me, but I love it! and have been surprised to discover that this was how my heart was always wanting to express itself to God. If you visit around, you will find that there are big differences between different Baptist congregations styles, by the way (I was raised Southern Baptist). Welcome to the forum, and freedom too! In talking with your daughter, be honest and very forward in the most basic "why" of your changes. Because it is the most important element of what has happened....you studied the Word, you became open in listening to God, and so you grew....you have learned as he taught you...you thought you were doing what was right before, but now understand that you had failed to really study things out for yourself. These are all key things that your child will need to know to do in her own walk with the Lord. There's no shame in the fact that you have made changes. The only shame would come if you had stayed where you were and continued to teach your children that it was right to be there. Give those folks in the churches you attend and opportunity to be friendly with you, get there a little early, take your time in leaving, smile at them, look them in the eye and say hello. You know, the people sitting around you just may be visitors or very new to the church, just like you. Maybe they are waiting for you to speak to them first. | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Lydell, I believe so long as the worship is done in Siprit and Truth then Grace will come upon the worshippers. The style of worship is personal preference. It's not a holy cannon. My friend, Sharon is very involved with the local Catholic church. I have gone with her several times. Two weeks ago I went to a special Healing Mass. Even the priest talked in tongues, as did, I would guess around 2/3 of the congreation. However, it was still very organized and reverant. For sevral years I regurally attended a local unprogrammed Quaker group. That is 50 minutes of group silent contemplation, meditation, prayer. Then if anyone has anything extremely profound to say he/she ay speek but it is NOT a discussion. After the 50 minutes of silence thereis thee querey of the wee. Each person is allowed one and only comment on the weeks querey. Then a business meeting, annoucements, potluck an we all get out of there. NO, Gods word is not preahed at all. I think worship style is personal preference. | ||
| Nate (Nate) |
Worship styles are so very different in various cultural settings. It does not make one right and the other wrong. I currently serve in a church that is entirely contemporary. Guitars, drums, tamborines, contemporary dance, etc. I love it. Yet I can find God present in high church liturgy also. While I prefer to move and clap and lift my hands to the Lord, (interstingly the word thanksgiving in the original language means extending the hands!) much like would be descrbed in Psalm 150, there are also times for quiet reflection. We do both at our church. We welcome casual dress and use a contemporary style because that is the culture of the people in our community. Yet there are times of deep quiet and reflection as Lydell described. We come forward and kneel at the front of the church and pour out our hearts with tears sometimes too. Sometimes we are led to pray for someone going through a tough time or suffering an illness. we gather together and pray for God's healing in their lives. There is room for all of these things. We don't get in a big hurry when we come together for worship. I have had the opportunity to travel around the country and around the world some. I have become convinced that God delights in our expression of worship as long as it is from the heart. God delights in contemporary worship even if it is formal, as long as it expresses a contemporary relationship with Jesus and a life filled to overflowing with His Spirit. The Father seeks such to worship Him. (John 4) those who worship in Spirit and in truth. Won't it be awesome to worship in heaven with all the varieties of styles and cultural expressions! I can hardly wait! God bless you all. In Christ, Greg | ||
| Sabra (Sabra) |
Still having a hard time finding a church since the move. We have visited only two because we had to keep going back to our previous church. Once because I was scheduled to sing and they asked me to and once because WE RENTED THE HOUSE!!!! Praise the Lord, just in time to make the mortgage. A wonderful single woman in her 50's rented it. I feel great about her. This week we are going to visit a church that appears non-denominational New Covenant Worship Center, it's big and I like big churches. I think it might be Church of God affiliated so we'll see. I love the Baptists but they are so reserved. I sang 'All Rise' and shocked and amazed...they all stood and some raised their hands in worship and it was truly a surprise! Lately the verse in 2 Tim. 3:5 "having a form of Godliness but denying the power therein" keeps coming to my mind. What exactly do you all think that verse means? Well, I know God will put us in the perfect place! Blessings to you Terryk and welcome! it will only get easier and better from here. | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
Sabra, I've often thought of that text, too. Paul talks about people having a form of godliness but denying its power in the context of the godlessness of the last days. He says the people who are like that will also be "lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of Godóhaving a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them." (2 Time. 3:2-5) I think that such people will have various guises of sprituality, and some will definitely have the guise of Christianity. What's interesting to me about the phrase is that it says they DENY the power of true godliness. So, it seems, they mouth the words, profess to worship and follow God, even profess to follow Christ. Remember what the Pharisees great sin was? They refused to believe all the evidence they had that Jesus was who he said he was, and they said he got his power from Beelzebub. They denied the power of God. Jesus told the disciples that slandering the Son of man was a forgivable sin, but blaspheming the Holy Spirit was not. For people to say that the power of God is really Satan's power is blasphemy. So, I see people who have a form of godliness but deny its power as people who say the right words but refuse the rebirth of the Holy Spirit. They like the form of religion and Christianity, but they want to be in control. They refuse the new birth. Those characteristics Paul lists in 2 Tim. 3:2-5 are in direct opposition to the fruit of the Spirit listed in Galatians 5:22-23. Praise God for calling us out of darkness! Colleen | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
Sounds like the SDA church to me. Oh I guess that was not nice. I am still in that anger stage remember. I think I am angry about the fact that people in the church and that was me up and til a few months ago will not even investigate the truth. If there is no truth in these web sites etc. why are you not allowed to find out for yourself if there is no truth in them. For years I never questioned that we knew the truth but I would read the Bible and it would say love your fellow brothers and sisters in Christ well that never went on much they usually were fighting about you are supposed to gaurd the edges of the sabbath do not go out as soon as sundet. etc. I do not know about all of you but what a releif I do not have to be the judge and jury about peoples spritiual life anymore. Oh they wear earrings they must not be spritual I know some of you know where I am coming from. | ||
| Sabra (Sabra) |
That's good Colleen, What do you think of denying healings and other miracles? You know Benny Hinn comes to mind and my mother is always telling me what a terrible man he is. I don't have an opinion of him because I don't know that much about him but I was thinking, TBN is worldwide and people in other countries who don't know God see those miracles and couldn't God be using him to convert them? I can't find anywhere in the Bible that satan heals anyone, or has the power to do so. Who are those that Jesus talks about healing and prophecying and He doesn't know them? He also said if anyone works a miracle in My Name they can not soon talk against Me. Confusing when you put the two together. | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
You all may wish I never found this site. Well Sabra I sugest you look up Benny Hinn-Apologetics research resources. I have done a lot of studying these last months and found many good answers to things but sad to say I did not write them down. One thing I remember it was about different healings that Jesus did it was for people who did not beleive in him. I am not saying he doew not heal today its just I watch these people on TV give me this for this they talk alot about wealth here in this world and they got a word from the Lord well I am sorry but after coming out of what I just did when people tell me that God is talking to them and giving them visions I run like the wind. God does talk to each and everyone of us but I do not beleive it is how this world preceives it. God does promise us peace that the world does not know he does not promise that anything is fair or wealth or health He promises that I can have Life with him forever if I accept his Grace. Well thats my two cents Terry | ||
| Clay (Clay) |
Welcome Terryk. I understand your anger and the pain of leaving. We all experience it. When we place our anger in God's hands, he will truly help us to deal with it and see only love and pity for our SDA friends who are still tightly holding on to their tradition and are afraid to investigate new truth. What can we expect, that is how we were taught in Adventism, to not question. When we leave it may not be possible to continue our old friendships for a time until we have dealt with the anger and are grounded in our new understanding and at peace about it. When that time comes , and it will, then we can endeavour to maintain the old friendships and just love them. They may or may not be open to us but that should be their decision not ours. My wife and I have realized clearly that its not about belonging to a church but rather about a personal relationship with our Saviour 24/7. There are many weekends that we spend all day either Saturday or Sunday in our reading room together just reading, praying , discussing what we have read, and listening to wonderful praise music. When the day is over we both feel it was a precious time together with our Lord and often better than we could recieve at a church. We attend many different churches on Sat night or Sunday and always feel we are with our brothers and sisters in Christ, no matter what the church may be. We may not enjoy a particular worship style as well as others, but that's OK. God uses different styles for different folks. We prefer a more relaxed casual worship with very wonderful praise songs that can be joyous and upbeat and then very meditative and deeply moving. I good worship leader understands how to bring the audience into the presence of God with the right songs. At times even the old hymns are meaningful with a little tweeking of the arrangement. Someone mentioned in this discussion that they feel their understanding of the New Covenant is even different than most Sun. churches. I very much feel that way. That's why we continue to look. Leaving Adventism and then accepting everything taught in most Sunday churches is not the answer for me. There are Sun. churches that are as steeped in legalism as many Adventist churches and others caught up in rituals, forms, and traditions that are meaningless to the many attenders. I believe we need to trust the Holy Spirit to guide us to the right congregation and that may not happen right away. We are fortunate that we have a small group (8) who left Adventism around the same time and we treasure our study time together. Its really a house church. We study, pray, cry and laugh together and always encourage each other in our journey. If the Holy Spirit grows it into a church we are willing to move in that direction. When we have our supports cut away from us and we are left to depend only on the Holy Spirit for our strength and encouragement, we will truly grow strong in the Lord. If God blesses us with a friend or two , or a church , to encourage us on our journey that will be an added blessing. I believe the truly spiritual gaints of yesterday were usually people that trusted only in their one to one relationship alone with God and often in very trying circumstances. He has promised never to leave us and that His grace is sufficient for us at all times. Yes, Terry I also find myself thinking I am a babe in my spiritual understanding. God has opened my eyes in so many area's and I feel so dependent on the Holy Spirit now. As a former pastor I used to think I understood it all. Now I feel I am just a student needing to continually sit as His feet to learn. What an exciting journey we are on. I encourage you to lean of Him 100% and see it as an exciting journey of faith that will streach you to the utmost. Its like a Master potter who has to break the old pot to reshape it into a wonderful new creation that will trully be a thing of beauty. Blessings to you Terry. His grace is sufficient for you. | ||
| Terryk (Terryk) |
Clay thank you so much for your encouraging words. I am a little jealious of your group that meet together. I do miss studying with others and it is very different to study with like minds who need to be cleansed of all that all junk. I would love to hear your story about how you left you said you were a pastor? What area are you in now? I am in Maryland there are people here whole churches have left but I live too far from those.Thanks again for all the prayers I pray eveyday that I do not get mislead and that I am leaning on him fully now. I have found for myself that it is such a simple gospel. The world has made it so much more I read about this church and you can not have instriments I read this church you have to speak in this you have to wear this once again all I have found is beleive that Christ died for me. This gives me the strength to go on and through he death we can come boldly to the Throne. Terry |
