| Author | Message | ||
| Darrell |
Ernie, When you did your research about early Christian worship, did you also find evidence that some Gentile Christian groups continued to worship on Sabbath for many centuries after the ressurection? Other researchers have claimed this is true. If I recall correctly the Coptic Christians in North Africa were one example. | ||
| Bruce H |
THE EPISTLE OF BARNABAS CHAPTER 2 [A.D. 100.] For He hath revealed tous by all the prophets that He needs neither sacrifices, nor burnt-offerings,nor oblations, saying thus, 3What is the multitude of your sacrifices unto Me, saith the Lord? I am full of burnt-offerings, and desire not the fat of lambs, and the blood of bulls and goats, not when ye come to appear before Me: for who hath required these things at your hands? Tread no more My courts, not though ye bring with you fine flour. Incense is a vain abomination unto Me, and your new moons and sabbaths I cannot endure. He has therefore abolished these things, that the new law of our Lord Jesus Christ, which is without the yoke of necessity, might have a human oblation. CHAPTER 4 Ye ought therefore to understand. And this also I further beg of you, as being one of you, and loving you both individually and collectively more than my own soul, to take heed now to yourselves, and not to be like some, adding largely to your sins, and saying, The covenant is both theirs and ours. But they thus finally lost it, after Moses had already received it. For the Scripture saith, And Moses was fasting in the mount forty days and forty nights, and received the covenant from the Lord, tables of stone written with the finger of the hand of the Lord; but turning away to idols, they lost it. For the Lord speaks thus to Moses: Moses go down quickly; for the people whom thou hast brought out of the land of Egypt have transgressed. And Moses understood [the meaning of God], and cast the two tables out of his hands; and their covenant was broken, in order that the covenant of the beloved Jesus might be sealed upon our heart, in the hope which flows from believing in Him. CHAPTER 15 Further, He says to them, Your new moons and your Sabbath I cannot endure. Ye perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfullness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens. CHAPTER 16 Moreover, I will also tell you concerning the temple, how the wretched [Jews], wandering in error, trusted not in God Himself, but in the temple, as being the house of God. For almost after the manner of the Gentiles they worshipped Him in the temple. But learn how the Lord speaks, when abolishing it: Who hath meted out heaven with a span, and the earth with his palm? Have not I. Thus saith the Lord, Heaven is My throne, and the earth My footstool: what kind of house will ye build to Me, or what is the place of My rest? Ye perceive that their hope is vain. Moreover, He again says, Behold, they who have cast down this temple, even they shall build it up again. It has so happened. For through their going to war, it was destroyed by their enemies; and now: they, as the servants of their enemies, shall rebuild it. Again, it was revealed that the city and the temple and the people of Israel were to be given up. For the Scripture saith, And 272 it shall come to pass in the last days, that the Lord will deliver up the sheep of His pasture, and their sheep-fold and tower, to destruction. And it so happened as the Lord had spoken. Let us inquire, then, if there still is a temple of God. There is where He himself declared He would make and finish it. For it is written, 3And it shall come to pass, when the week is completed, the temple of God shall be built in glory in the name of the Lord. I find, therefore, that a temple does exist. Learn, then, how it shall be built in the name of the Lord. Before we believed in God, the habitation of our heart was corrupt and weak, as being indeed like a temple made with hands. For it was full of idolatry, and was a habitation of demons, through our doing such things as were opposed to [the will of] God. But it shall be built, observe ye, in the name of the Lord, in order that the temple of the Lord may be built in glory. How? Learn [as follows]. Having received the forgiveness of sins, and placed our trust in the name of the Lord, we have become new creatures, formed again from the beginning. Wherefore in our habitation God truly dwells in us. How? His word of faith; His calling of promise; the wisdom of the statutes; the commands of the doctrine; He himself prophesying in us; He himself dwelling in us; opening to us who were enslaved by death the doors of the temple, that is, the mouth; and by giving us repentance introduced us into the incorruptible temple. He then, who wishes to be saved, looks not to man, but to Him who dwelleth in him, and speaketh in him, amazed at never having either heard him utter such words with his mouth, nor himself having ever desired to hear them. This is the spiritual temple built for the Lord. BH .. | ||
| Ernie |
Darrell: It is true that some early Coptic communities kept Sabbath as a day of rest and Sunday as a day worship. There is no evidence of Sabbath-keeping Adventist style among the rest of Christianity, and the only groups that kept Sabbath along with Sunday were some Coptic communities in Africa and Syria. By the fourth centuries those groups had abandoned the practice of keeping Sabbath altogether. It seems to me they had been influenced by the Ebionites-a judaizer heretic group within the early Christian church. Ernie | ||
| Ernie |
Cas: The Adventists have twisted the evidence regarding the whole question of Sabbath and Sunday. The Pope never changed the day of rest. Actually, by the time the Council of Laodicea (323 AD) the practice of Sunday as a day of worship was so generalized, the Council declared it as the official Christian day of worship. However, the practice of it had begun late in the first century. Regarding my seminars, I am conducting one right now in Montreal, Canada. By the end of the month is going to be London, England. Next year will be a couple of places in Latin America and some places in the States. As soon as I have the final details about the meetings in Southern Calfornia, I will let you know. Ernie | ||
| Lydell |
Ernie, appreciate you sharing your research with everyone. Isn't it sad that it takes us so long to finally step back and ask ourselves some simple questions? Like, if sabbathkeeping is truly THE issue with God then why has he apparently been so wimpy on having the message proclaimed? I mean, gee, nearly 2,000 years of New Testament church history and he has been letting it slide all this time? All these years and he has continued to bless people who were worshipping on Sunday? He has continued to answer their prayers instead of ignoring them? And the most annoying thing of all is that we spent all that time in the SDA church mouthing the words "well, the Lord has true believers in all Christian denominations", yet when we leavethe church we are nervous about actually worshipping with them. It doesn't matter that the rest of that saying was always, "but of course someday they will begin keeping the sabbath." The truth should have dawned on us that if "there are true believers" in those congregations, then they can't be too darned dangerous to us. Either He does show up and meet with folks where two or three are gathered in His name or He doesn't. For that one who was still feeling nervous about worshipping with "them", you have just got to ask yourself, "is He God or not?" If you are looking to Him believing in your heart that He IS truth then you can rest in the assurance that He WILL lead you to a true body of believers. Sure it's a little scary at first. But anytime we have to step out in faith relying totally on Him it is like that! Please don't stay shut away from God's people. He has such awesome things in store for you! There are folks in those churches who need the ministry through your own special giftings as much as you need them. Don't shut yourself out of such a marvelous blessing by staying home. | ||
| Ernie |
Lydell: Amen. It takes the glorious light of God's Truth to make us understand such powerful things. Adventism is utterly a fraud. Just this morning I tuned a Christian radio station that serves my area and heard the Voice the Prophecy. The teacher was using the Clear Word Bible as it was a translation and quoting from it with all authority. Isn't that sad? I felt really bad to realise that once I belonged to a church that needs all kind of deceit to get members because it has a flawed theological ground. God bless you, Ernie | ||
| Bruce H |
I hear some people asking did God Change the day from Saturday to Sunday. I hope this is not so, for I could not keep the Saturday sabbath How could I keep a sunday sabbath. I feel this is not the right question the real question is did he fufill the Sabbath. God gave us a new Covenant and he did not give us a lot of rules and regulation's but his own Spirit that indwells us and gives us life and teaches us. When we Talk about Sabbath it is the one that we ENTER INTO PERIOD. Now as for the Lord's Day (sunday, eighth day) let us celebrate it if the spirit leads us to. If it is Saturday, Wensday, Thursday, Friday or Monday and the Spirit leads us let us celebrate that day to the Lord. But a word of Caution. If you take on the Sign of the Old Covenant be careful of the curse. BH |
