| Author | Message | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 12700 Registered: 12-2003  |
Hi, all--we just returned from spending the week in San Diego at the annual Evangelical Free Church's leadership conference where Life Assurance Ministries had a booth. It was the first time we've been there, and we had many responses from people saying they were so thankful that we were there. As always, we had a gamut of reactions, from one pastor who argued with Dale Ratzlaff that the Adventists were just fine because his SDA pastor-friend articulates all the "right" things—to another pastor from California who said, "I am SO glad you're here; my young members keep dating Adventists, and the Adventists won't come to our church because of the mark of the beast, and eventually my members start going to church with the Adventist date, and sometimes they leave." This pastor lives near the home offices of Rose Publishing and somehow learned about the new 10 Q & A about Seventh-day Adventists. He's begun buying them and giving them out to his members. He said that brochure resulted in one young woman recently breaking up with her SDA boyfriend recently. He signed up for Proclamation and was beyond grateful. We heard Joni Erickson Tada last night...she spoke very vulnerably about how hard it is 80% of the time for her to get up in the morning, and she has to actually pray her way into the day. She said a lot of people still pray for her healing, and she said, by all means--keep praying--but please pray that God will heal my heart so I don't whine, so I don't criticize people and think the worst of them. Please pray that I will stop manipulating my husband with well-placed one-liners. Please pray that I will stop complaining about my circumstances and pray that I will be kind and that I will praise God and trust Him." I doubt there was a dry eye in that room. She is a powerful example of trusting God. She said, "We have a rigorous gospel that demands that we trust God when we suffer; it's not just about God being my friend as I skip on the surface of life. When we suffer, we need a gospel that carries us through unspeakable pain. This is the gospel that carries me." Must go for now, but I wanted to check in and let you all know some of the things that have impacted me this week. Colleen | ||
| Angelcat Registered user Username: Angelcat Post Number: 327 Registered: 11-2008 |
Wow. Joni Eareckson Tada's books really helped me deal with the issue of healing. | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 1955 Registered: 6-2006  |
"Please pray that I will stop manipulating my husband with well-placed one-liners." LOL, I think a lot of us have that problem! Also, the pastor who argued for the SDA church ~ I'm afraid that's the general concensus. I don't think they still do this, but many of the protestant pastors in my home town would have a yearly luncheon and the SDA pastor always showed up. This was at least 20 years ago when I heard about it, so again, not sure if they still do that. Makes me wonder, what was going through this guy's mind, to mingle with Sunday keepers?! Of course, the Sunday keepers were clueless to the ways of SDA... Colleen, you were in my neck of the woods. By any chance did you meet Pastor Gary Bowman? He pastors at our neighborhood EV Free church and is a family friend. Looking forward to reading more about your experience!  Leigh Anne | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 12701 Registered: 12-2003 |
Leigh Anne, I didn't meet Gary Bowman, but he was likely there. SDA pastors still become members of the local pastor's organizations...it's all part of blending in on the surface. I've had people tell me they know such-and-such an SDA pastor from the local pastor's organization. It all is so deceptive and self-serving, it seems. On the one hand, Adventists silently feel superior to "mere" Christians because they SDAs have the "meat" of the gospel, not "just Jesus". On the other hand, they desperately want to be acknowledged as fellow Christians. It's such a dichotomy! Colleen | ||
| Free2dance Registered user Username: Free2dance Post Number: 350 Registered: 2-2010 |
Colleen, I was recently having the conversation with a friend about how when we left no one came to us with a Bible in hand. Not one pastor or friend wanted to open the word with us, but all of them became silent and stopped contacting us. This said two things to me. One, they don't believe we did the right thing by leaving, and two, they either don't know how to talk Bible, or they don't want to appear to publicly disagree with the evangelical world. If they believe we did the wrong thing, it's clear they are not evangelical. If they cannot talk Bible then I hope on some level they are deeply convicted of their need to learn truth. Moreover, if it is about their reputation with the Evangelical world, then I hope this too convicts them of their pride that they would let a "soul fall" rather than be seen as anti-evangelical. I am so sad when I hear people accuse this ministry of dividing the body. I am sure there are many who have come into Christendom and done what they believe we are doing. However, this mantra of "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me" runs the risk of ignorant responses to emotional triggers that are simply that, emotional triggers. If only they would look at the information before forming an opinion based on a bias of anyone who would contend for the faith within Christendom. They must know cults come from with in the claims of Christianity??? "There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call— one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all." All these pastors have to do is read the SDA church manual (which might be worth printing and handing out at these things) and look closely at their language (first studying their glossary of terms). There is "one body", but SDAs break off the church and call themselves the remnant (they tuck it neatly in the manual by referring to the SDA's as the "capital 'C' church" and the other professing Christians as the "lower case 'c' church". It may be the other way around, but one way or another, they differentiate! ). There is "one faith", but SDAS also have "Adventist Truth" which clearly sets their truth apart from the Truth of the gospel. I do not believe that Faith in the SDA truth comes from God. It was never easy to believe SDA doctrine. It was a human effort and it was full of fear. Two indications to me that it was not a gift, wrapped in the peace of God! "One baptism"...well, rebaptism for Christians converted from other churches would set their baptism apart from the baptism of the gospel. "One Lord"... scripture teaches us that a different gospel has a different Jesus. Unfinished atonement and the investigative judgment are ONLY present in the SDA gospel and in no other Christian church because it is NOT the gospel of the Bible. "Who is over all"...their idol of free will places them as being free from God's complete rule. Their rejection and blindness on the mystery of election and predestination is evidence of their need to understand God or reject the truths about Him that confuse them (e.g. hell, sovereignty, rapture, future for Israel, a new covenant, total depravity of man, the image of God...etc.). Their arguments show that they cannot let God be over or above their thinking, otherwise He is not a god they would "want to worship". "In all..." A God that leaves you at the door of the movie theater is not indwelling. They themselves divide themselves from the Body of Christ and they not only complain about those who would "split the body" but they send the Evangelical Christian pastors who are "beneath" them to do their bidding as well. How has Christendom failed SDAs so badly? Sigh... I am SOOO glad you guys went! I am certain this will be a slow process, but one way or another, TRUTH shines in the darkness and the darkness has not overcome it. All will be seen at some point, I just pray it's sooner rather than later. | ||
| Animal Registered user Username: Animal Post Number: 951 Registered: 7-2008  |
Question.... Why do wives try to manipulate their husbands?..I know...a dumb question to ask..lol lol. Animal...not afraid to ask the dumb question! | ||
| Jdpascal Registered user Username: Jdpascal Post Number: 284 Registered: 10-2003 |
They believe the mens mantra..... I am a man. I can change. If I have to... ;) | ||
| Free2dance Registered user Username: Free2dance Post Number: 351 Registered: 2-2010 |
I think it's because we want to elicit some kind of emotion or information from them. If I can't get my husband to communicate with me I often create ways of getting something- anything- to come out of his mouth. Sometimes even just a good fight gives me insight into how he is doing. I have to say, I don't see this happening so much anymore, but Im sure it will again. We are all a work in progress. | ||
| Philharris Registered user Username: Philharris Post Number: 2483 Registered: 5-2007  |
Animal, What do you mean by "try to maniulate..."? I guess I am also not afraid to ask something dumb. Fearless Phil |
