| Author | Message | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 1800 Registered: 6-2006  |
Hi Friends, Just wanted to let you all know that BSF (Bible Study Fellowship) has started for the year. The book we're studying this time around is Isaiah. For those of you not aware of BSF, it's a wonderful verse by verse, straight study of the Bible. It's non-denominational, and they ask that you not mention or refer to your particular church. They also will not allow use of commentaries or even study Bibles. Again, this is straight Bible study. It goes from September to May, very much like a school year, with holiday weeks off. I started in the middle of last year with the book of John and it was wonderful. It's roughly a two hour class. For the year you have a discussion group (usually about 10 - 15 people) for the first hour, and then a lecture of the second hour. In the lecture, the leader reads each verse and explains historical details. At the beginning of each session we sing two hymns and have a prayer. The studies are not co-ed. In other words, they have mens only classes and womens only classes. Our BSF also offers BSF for kids during each session. BSF is all over the world and in some cases have several class times offered depending where you live. It's a great way to get serious, inductive Bible study. http://www.bsfinternational.org/Distinctives/tabid/68/Default.aspx  Leigh Anne | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 146 Registered: 5-2009 |
Leigh Anne, This is awesome. I have been in a nondenom bible study for the past 13 years & it has really been my 'church'. Ours operates the similarly - no mention of church affiliation or doctrine, no use of commentaries, study notes, just wrestle it out with God. Let scripture explain scripture, & let the Holy Spirit bring understanding. That was when I first read entire books of the Bible. I just picked up the book 'True to His Word - The Story of BSF Celebrating 50 Years of Service'. I'm about halfway through. It's an interesting & inspiring read. Some of the 'in their own words' stories are very interesting. Some men said that their wives got involved & they changed - so much so that their husbands decided to get into the men's study. Others said that they 'were prayed in' by their wives. BSFI has been in China for a number of years in the ex-pat community. Because the founder, Wetherell Johnson had been a missionary to China in the 1930s, & because BSF never tried to contact the underground house churches or proselytize, never got involved in politics, never were secretive, they have now been asked by the government to offer BSF classes to Chinese citizens in a Three-Self church. And so many Chinese pastors have requested training for themselves, there are plans being developed to do so. I am praying that my family members will become involved in a bible study fellowship. One daughter & son-in-law live in Asia. BSFI needs translators to translate into Mandarin & they need teachers. DSIL (never-been) wants to find a church & DD is stuck on the 7th day sabbath & is reluctant. DSIL is an Asian Christian & I dream that he becomes involved somehow in getting people into God's word. His grandfather was a Christian Indian pastor in India. His mother is Chinese & he knows languages. All things are possible with God! Anyway, interesting timing for me - your post, the book. J9 | ||
| Bb Registered user Username: Bb Post Number: 812 Registered: 7-2004 |
Thanks for telling everyone about it, Leigh Anne! I am so excited about studying Isaiah this year. I just got back from class and am already learning so much! It's fun to know that everyone around the world are hearing the same thing, and answering the same questions and reading the same notes! | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 11725 Registered: 12-2003  |
BSF really is wonderful. I've never done it myself, but I know many women who have--and a lot of former Adventists I know started out with BSF's Bible studies. It's extremely important for those of us who have learned to think and interpret Scripture from a non-biblical worldview to study the Bible with people who don't share our biases and backgrounds. If we don't immerse ourselves in Bible study with "regular" Christians, we tend to retain pockets of false assumptions that take a very long time to come into focus (if they ever do), and we tend to retain the feeling that we know the Bible better than those mere Christians who didn't take the Bible as seriously as we did. Colleen | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 148 Registered: 5-2009 |
Colleen said: "If we don't immerse ourselves in Bible study with "regular" Christians, we tend to retain pockets of false assumptions that take a very long time to come into focus (if they ever do), and we tend to retain the feeling that we know the Bible better than those mere Christians who didn't take the Bible as seriously as we did." It's amazing how similar our thinking & experiences are - evidence of brainwashing?! Even though I've been in the bible study for 13 years, I thought I was going to 'win them to the truth' or at least get them thinking. But at least I was exposed to entire books of the bible & others experiences. I was aware at times when I said something that I thought was general christian belief & saw questioning, quizzical looks on peoples' faces. And what a false lie to think that as SDAs we 'knew' the bible. J9 | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 1801 Registered: 6-2006 |
J9, that is wild! Sounds like a "God thing" to me. Might be a confirmation... Leigh Anne | ||
| Javagirl Registered user Username: Javagirl Post Number: 724 Registered: 6-2005  |
J9 " I thought I was going to 'win them to the truth' or at least get them thinking. But at least I was exposed to entire books of the bible & others experiences. I was aware at times when I said something that I thought was general christian belief & saw questioning, quizzical looks on peoples' faces". I had the exact same experience! Truth won out, and I heard and believed the gospel and was born again in spite of myself and 4 generations of SDA indoctrination! | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 158 Registered: 5-2009 |
Leigh Anne, even wilder is the fact that the woman who invited me to the bible study used to work for my husband & got fired. It was a big mess. Years later I ran into her in a 12 step group. She recognized me, but I didn't recognize her. Then after a few years in 12 step we had reconciled; then the bible study came up. Talk about a "God thing"! There's a lot more to this story, hers & mine, & it's not finished yet. Sufficient to say she & I are spiritually connected. Javagirl (do you like coffee?!) I'm glad you shared that - it gives hope! & I don't feel so strange - even though it's taken me 20 years to begin to get loose, & River asked me 'WHY?' & All I could say was 'I've been in a coma!' J9 | ||
| Javagirl Registered user Username: Javagirl Post Number: 726 Registered: 6-2005 |
J9, yes, coffee is a favorite, although in the past few years i drink mostly tea for the health benefits. But i do love coffee. It took me 7 years of Bible study (with no commentary allowed) to "discover" the gospel and leave the SDA chuch. ....just let River know that he has to take into account that some of us were weaned on Ellenism..... . But when we are set free from weak and useless religion look out! We come out of our comas with or without coffee! | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 6761 Registered: 9-2006  |
After you read 'Preparation Day' ya ought to know that I know more than I pretend I do. But if I didn't yank chains around here, it would be down right dull! River By the way, I drink tea, no coffee, we might have some in common Lori! | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 160 Registered: 5-2009 |
LOL River! I am just learning to really make a good cup of coffee that tastes as good as fresh ground coffee beans smell. But tea is my all-time fave - Earl Grey - never get tired of it. For me, not only weaned on Ellenism, but generational bondage. Thanks for the hope Javagirl. BTW I read parts of the BSFI book aloud yesterday as my hubby & I traveled. We Both had tears at what GOD can do. There is POWER in the Word. And He wants us IN IT. J9 | ||
| Javagirl Registered user Username: Javagirl Post Number: 727 Registered: 6-2005 |
I really enjoyed your story "preparation day", River! You really do get the whole "adventist preparation day frenzy/paranoia/pride/idolatry.... J9 Generational bondage sigh, 4th generation SDA from both sides of the family. That being said, "There is joy in the letting go!!!" Lori | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 6771 Registered: 9-2006 |
I know nothing about BSFI, but I take it that it is a contextual bible study. Colleen remarked:If we don't immerse ourselves in Bible study with "regular" Christians, we tend to retain pockets of false assumptions that take a very long time to come into focus (if they ever do), and we tend to retain the feeling that we know the Bible better than those mere Christians who didn't take the Bible as seriously as we did. I don't want to completely destroy Leigh Anne's thread by changing the subject. But I think a very important word has been used here. Generational bondage. I think we need to explore generational bondage more than we have in the past, how it affects us, and how we can get rid of those 'pockets' of false assumptions caused by generational bondage. How generational bondage affects those who are still in Adventism, and how it makes it so very difficult to evangelize them. We need to ask questions, what is generational bondage, does it really exist? If so why? Are we afraid to explore generational bondage because we are afraid we will question Gods sovereignty? What Colleen said about 'pockets' of false assumptions, are these also pockets of resistance? I ask J9, "What took you so long?" There was a reason for that question. Colleen says:we tend to retain pockets of false assumptions that take a very long time to come into focus (if they ever do), Notice the (if they ever do), we want to make sure they 'ever do'. The Bible says somewhere in proverbs, "With all thy getting, get understanding, and with understanding into generational bondage, perhaps we can bring those pockets of false assumptions more quickly, be free of them and move on. Merwin Rhoades and I talked about CB theology, a term that applies to truckers who get their theology from listening to the radio in their long haul trucks. Is this what the former ends up with? If ask what are you? Can you say, I am CatholicBaptistMethodistPentecostalLutherannondenomiantional? Or have you just traded one set of beliefs for another set of beliefs that you find you are comfortable with? I know formers who have done that, and they are just as much this as they were that. If we can understand generational bondage better, we may be able to evangelize Adventist better. Is this too many questions for you to handle at one time? If God had meant for us to have no understanding, do you think he would have said, "With all thy getting, get it? Getting understanding is not necessarily knowledge, many people have knowledge, yet no understanding. Lori said, "You really do get the whole "adventist preparation day frenzy/paranoia/pride/idolatry.... yes, I do get it, because my getter got to really gettin after the get, and I kept getting till I got. And I don't have a good enough understanding into this generational thing, and it's getting to my getter, and its got to get got. River | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 165 Registered: 5-2009 |
River, yes let's start a new thread & discuss this. Some people would not find this & comment because they won't click on BSFI - but might be interested in generational bondage. BSFI is inductive bible study. Example: What does it say? What does it mean? What does it mean to me? More Holy Spirit guided - no outside 'helps' as has been stated above. J9 | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 6772 Registered: 9-2006 |
J9, I agree lets. BSFI sounds like an excellent program. River | ||
| Skeeter Registered user Username: Skeeter Post Number: 1068 Registered: 12-2007 |
I just checked and the closest one to me is 40 miles away and is only on Monday nights 7pm. It is the only one within 200 miles.....oh well.... too bad they dont have an online version.... | ||
| 1john2v27nlt Registered user Username: 1john2v27nlt Post Number: 168 Registered: 5-2009 |
Skeeter, the book about BSFI tells of people who drove 3 & 5 hours each way to attend BSFI. And it tells of people who prayed for 18 years for a class to be started. And people who were on waiting lists up to 3 years. Sounds awful until you read the book & understand thre reasons - & see what God brought about. And how lives were changed, how people accepted Jesus. God's ways are not our ways, His plans not our plans. Is 55:8 J9 | ||
| Hec Registered user Username: Hec Post Number: 1414 Registered: 3-2009 |
I've been thinking of joining a Bible study. I have one close to my house. However, I'm wondering about this report. Could some one who is experienced in BSF comment on this report. Hec | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 11739 Registered: 12-2003 |
Hec, there are always detractors. I've even seen websites for "former evangelicals" that detail why evangelical Christianity is a cult. Frankly, that report was problematic on so many levels. First, BSF is like any congregation. It is possible to have mature, insightful leaders, but it's also possible to have a leader who is, perhaps, less mature. One cannot make a broad-based assumption about BSF because there are the occasional leaders who handle individual situations less than optimally. Second, the whole argument that BSF is unscriptural because a woman founded it, mostly women direct it, etc., is twisting Scripture. For the writer of that report to say women have no business teaching women the Bible is to completely miss the point. Women are the most logical people to teach women, in women-only groups. A church congregation is one thing...I support male preacher models. But in a women's ministry group--it would be inappropriate for a man to come into a women's ministry group and try to teach them.. In our women's ministry (which is a local church thing, not BSF), our director teaches us for a half hour before our small groups. She is, first of all, educated and an excellent teacher who has given me an unprecedented "big picture" understanding of how the Bible fits together. but more to the point, she talks about issues of respect, obedience, honoring husbands, etc etc...and these are things she says often spontaneously. She models living in submission to the word of God and being obedient to Him in ongoing, growing ways. A man could NEVER address women's lives and make Scripture apply to their lives the way a woman can. And no woman should be forced to confide her personal or home struggles to a male teacher...Women need other women to hold them accountable and to pray for them. This person's arguments are just wrong. Moreover, when did the gift of teaching become exclusively a masculine gift? And what subjects does a gift of teaching include? Can a woman teach math and history, but never teach Bible to other women? And to what ages does this apply? When does a "boy" become a "man"? Should a 40-year-old woman be required to learn Bible from men only, even if the only male available to teach is a--let's say--25-year-old single guy who know the Word but knows little of life, to say nothing of his biblical mandate to treat older women with the respect they would give a mother? I'm not trying to negate the biblical mandate for women to learn from men. But women's Bible studies really are truly functional when they are run by women. BSF does not have female teachers teaching the male classes. That would be wrong. But nowhere does Scripture forbid women from writing Bible curricula, and Wetherell Johnson had male theologians/teachers read and approve her material before publishing it. She wrote in submission to the input of others, including men. Hec, ask God to clarify to you where He wants you to study the Bible. If it seems He is opening the way for you to join BSF, go in submission to Him and allow Him to teach you His truth and guide you according to His will. He will not lead you away from His will. Colleen | ||
| Hec Registered user Username: Hec Post Number: 1419 Registered: 3-2009 |
I had problems with this woman in this article. That's why I submitted it to the forum. But my main problem is not with women teaching. I'd gladly attend a Bible study directed by a woman. I am not sure that the Bible teaches that the woman cannot teach a man. That might have been some cultural, local thing during Paul's time. The same Paul also said that there is no more Jew nor gentile, man nor woman, but we are all one in Jesus. So I have no problems with that. I just had a bad feeling about the article. It seems to me that the lady author has some ax to grind and decided to use the Web to bring them down. But I did want to get the forum take on it. So if others still feel like giving me some feedback from their experience with BSF, please do. Thanks, Hec |
