| Author | Message | ||
| Mountaingirl Registered user Username: Mountaingirl Post Number: 63 Registered: 8-2013 |
Guess she writes from the grave too. All joking aside the local SDA church which I get emails from still sent this out in case members want to buy it at some special price. Quote from email, " As most of you know, there’s a major motion picture on the story of Noah coming to theaters March 28. There’s a new sharing book that is timely and presents Biblical truth on the topic." Information sent about the book: A worldwide, catastrophic flood. It reshaped the face of the planet. It killed millions of animals. It ended the lives of countless men, women, and children. Why would anyone believe a God of love would punish the world like that? You’re not alone. Questions like this one have mystified honest, searching people for thousands of years. Skeptics discredit the event as a mere myth, proof that God is nothing more than a cruel tyrant invented by men, while believers struggle to harmonize the love of Jesus and this frightening Old Testament story. There is an answer that actually makes sense that will help you understand the mind of God when it comes to evil, sin, suffering, pain, and punishment. In this stunning, in-depth exploration of the real story of Noah, you’ll discover all the great themes at play in this world-changing event. You’ll not only get an accurate, biblical, and historical narrative of the life and times of Noah, you’ll better grasp the vital spiritual themes that will expand your Bible literacy and grow your trust in God’s plan for our planet—and for you. The story of Noah still matters today. Jesus warned that the history of Noah’s time and the greatest storm the world has ever seen would repeat itself just prior to His return. That new storm is coming soon. To survive it, you will need to have the faith of Noah, the faith to believe when so many doubt, the faith to be patient when all seems lost, and the faith to trust God and His Word for 120 years—so long against so many odds—when every day your friends call you crazy and fanatical. This book will show you how to have that extraordinary faith. Since we here at Remnant Publications have a burden for people’s faith in God to grow, we assembled some of the best faith-building material about the tempest that is rapidly gathering. E. G. White devotedly penned such information on this topic, so we used three of her sources: Patriarchs and Prophets, The Desire of Ages, and The Great Controversy. Thus, this excellent tool will lead to a fuller understanding about the pending storm. Table of Contents Introduction Part 1—The Real Story: “As in the Days of Noah . . .” 1. The Building of the Ark: The Flood—Part I 2. Destruction by Water: The Blood—Part II 3. The Rainbow Sign: After the Flood 4. Skepticism over Creation and the Flood: The Literal Week 5. Descendants of Noah and the Tower of Babel: The Tower of Babel Part 2—The Coming Storm: “As in the Days of Lot . . .” 6. Sodom’s Last Night: Destruction of Sodom—Part I 7. Destruction by Fire: Destruction of Sodom—Part II 8. The Impending Doom: On the Mount of Olives—Part I 9. Take Heed! On the Mount of Olives—Part II Part 3—The Problem of Evil: “As on That Day . . .” 10. Why Was Sin Permitted? The Origin of Evil 11. God’s Power at Midnight: God’s People Delivered—Part I 12. The Final Deliverance: God’s People Delivered—Part 11 13. The Pulse of Harmony: The Controversy Ended - See more at: http://www.remnantpublications.com/default/index.php/books/noah-1/noah.html#full-desctription | ||
| Capross Registered user Username: Capross Post Number: 81 Registered: 7-2012 |
I have to respond to the line that states Jesus warned the "storm" will repeat itself at the end of time. God said He would not do that again. Hence the rainbow. Gen 9:8 Then God said to Noah and to his sons with him: 9 “I now establish my covenant with you and with your descendants after you 10 and with every living creature that was with you—the birds, the livestock and all the wild animals, all those that came out of the ark with you—every living creature on earth. 11 I establish my covenant with you: Never again will all life be destroyed by the waters of a flood; never again will there be a flood to destroy the earth.” 12 And God said, “This is the sign of the covenant I am making between me and you and every living creature with you, a covenant for all generations to come: 13 I have set my rainbow in the clouds, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and the earth. 14 Whenever I bring clouds over the earth and the rainbow appears in the clouds, 15 I will remember my covenant between me and you and all living creatures of every kind. Never again will the waters become a flood to destroy all life. 16 Whenever the rainbow appears in the clouds, I will see it and remember the everlasting covenant between God and all living creatures of every kind on the earth.” 17 So God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant I have established between me and all life on the earth.” I choose to listen to God not EGW | ||
| Rioranchoprays Registered user Username: Rioranchoprays Post Number: 12 Registered: 3-2014 |
Well, friends, This book is really a complication of all that EGW wrote about the flood. Interesting that the church that owns all of the EGW library and makes tons of money from those same books now has come up with a timely redo of EGW's Noah story. For the can't get enough of EGW crowd this will be a welcome addition to their EGW personal library. If Mrs. White actually wrote her books, maybe. If she was really an original writer, maybe. But we have plenty of evidence that the best parts of her books were copied by her scribes. See Walter Rea's book, The White Lie for evidence that she copies much of the Conflict of the Ages series. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 14756 Registered: 12-2003  |
Remnant Publications is such a money-maker. It is not officially Adventist. It is independent. But it works with the church closely and obviously has the rights to publish the books. There are SO many "independent" Adventist organizations and corporations, all of which can claim they are not officially "Adventist" because they are independent. The blatant deception has become so common they absolutely think nothing of it. It's SO irritating to me! Colleen | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 520 Registered: 1-2007 |
"Why would anyone believe a God of love would punish the world like that?" Something I struggle with believing myself. Paul | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1367 Registered: 2-2011  |
GOD is also a GOD of Justice! ~mj~ | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 521 Registered: 1-2007 |
I get the justice part, but it doesn't seem like Justice when all living creatures pay the price for the crimes of others. | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1368 Registered: 2-2011 |
I do not pretend to try to comprehend GOD's 'economy'! However, I do Trust GOD~ Anytime I 'question' in my own mind, "Why" GOD? I go back to the book of Job in Scripture and read chapters 38-41. This helps me put into perspective, who i am, and Who "HE" is! In fact, I find the complete book of Job very instructive! ~mj~ | ||
| Philharris Registered user Username: Philharris Post Number: 3012 Registered: 5-2007  |
MJ, You've just said what I was about to say. As Job learned, who am I to question what God does? It is hard and I still struggle with the 'why' but sin does exist and the consequences are all around me and it's still a mystery to me but God is sovereign. God created me and everything around me. Scripture teaches that God loves and saves all who come to him in faith and he does this in spite of our weaknesses and failures. Yes, the ‘why’ is still there but my faith is anchored on God’s promises. Grasping an understanding of the last chapters of the Book of Job resolved this for me while it is still remains a mystery to me. Why does God promise to never let me go even though I still sin? That is another mystery. Fearless Phil | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 522 Registered: 1-2007 |
Honestly, for me, the book of job only tells me that God places bets with Satan, then scolds people when they question why. I don't have blind faith it's certainly not a gift bestowed upon me so I am left to reason with the very mind that god gave me. Sorry to be a Negative Nancy but I am only trying to be honest with the way I perceive things. Is it wretched to feel it's wrong that a god pretty much wiped out an entire planet for the sake of man's evil deeds? What do I know, I'm only human LOL | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 523 Registered: 1-2007 |
With that I think I will stay away from this forum, I do not wish to interfere with the good work done here in helping bring others out of the cult. Godspeed Paul | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1369 Registered: 2-2011 |
Pnoga~ I hope you will reconsider your decision to leave the Forum ! ~mj~ | ||
| Philharris Registered user Username: Philharris Post Number: 3013 Registered: 5-2007 |
God challenged Satan to prove his point and Satan lost. That's not the same as betting. Job, most importantly, wasn't scolded. God very tactfully asked Job to answer certain questions centered on Creation, if he could. Job realized that since only God was there only God has the answers. The only ones God demanded that they repent of their sins were Job’s false friends who presumed to know the mind of God. Since God demonstrates his faithfulness, he wasn’t asking Job to live by ‘blind faith’ in what God was telling him. Sin has some very terrible consequences. Faith in God has important eternally good consequences. Those who place their trust in God’s promises have never been betrayed. That is what Hebrews chapter eleven is all about. Christians can expect to face tribulations but are never abandoned by their Lord and Savior. Corrie ten boom's sister who died on a concentration camp is testimony of God’s faithfulness and why Corrie was able, after the war, to take the message of the Savior who died for all sinners to the very guards who made their lives so hard. For those who honestly question God, God gives an answer, just like he did for Job. Once when I had this very same question God miraculously preserved my life when I should have been killed. Since then I have never doubted God while I certainly question my own faithfulness. I fail, all too often, but God has never failed me. Faith is knowing God never fails to keep his promises and isn’t founded upon my own faithfulness. Fearless Phil | ||
| Trans4mer Registered user Username: Trans4mer Post Number: 431 Registered: 9-2011  |
My question is "who's going to win in the end?" 2 Corinthians 13:8 For we cannot do anything against the truth, but only for the truth. It's good to be on the winning side. Charles | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1371 Registered: 2-2011 |
Pnoga~ In your post #522 you write that you do not have "blind faith,"... "it was not a gift bestowed on me." In Scripture it tells us that we need to look to JESUS for our Faith~ We need to pray for Faith, Because-- "Looking unto JESUS the 'Author and Finisher' of our faith; who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of GOD." Hebrews 12:2. If you desire 'Faith' to Believe, I believe it is only a prayer a way~ ~mj~ | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 524 Registered: 1-2007 |
Valid points I was mistaken he did not scold Job, he scolded his friends. My point was I do not have blind faith, all these characters in the bible have one thing in common they all speak with god and see his miracles and interact with him in ways I am not privy to. So their faith is a gift, God gifted them with his presence in a way that it would be hard to deny a god exists. Paul | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1377 Registered: 2-2011 |
Pnoga~ Again, addressing the line in your post #522," blind faith"...it was not a gift bestowed on me." This reminds me of the film, 'Angels and Demons,' in the scene where the priest asks the man, played by actor, Tom Hanks, if he has 'faith'? I am assuming in the 'super-natural' (God). ~mj~ | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1383 Registered: 2-2011 |
Pnoga~ One more thought for you to ponder regarding "Faith"~ Each one of us has to decide whether we are going to Believe GOD's Word, Or~ Are we going to Believe our eyes and emotions. ~mj~ | ||
| Trans4mer Registered user Username: Trans4mer Post Number: 433 Registered: 9-2011 |
Pnoga, I don't know where you are in transitioning out of Adventism but I believe that I recognize where you are. I also HATED the book of Job with a passion, saying the same thing about God and Satan taking bets on man as if he were a pawn in a chess game. I reread some of your posts and became alarmed at the way your words were trending. Please don't give up! Study and fight until you see more clearly and trust in the Word more fully. I believe I can offer you some real spiritual 'weapons' that at least worked well for me rather than just platitudes and generalities. Regarding the book of Job that was also so difficult for me, there is a historic, well known theologian named Oswald Chambers who wrote "Our Ultimate Refuge", formerly called "Baffled to Fight Better". I can't tell you how sensible and timely that little book was for me. Another 'shield' that worked well for me was the notion that I don't have to map it all out perfectly. If I come across something or someone that I don't like or understand to persevere by hunting, studying, praying and communicating with my saintly friends in the FAF Bible study. It works. Just try it. Another theological master of the present day, John MacArthur has also been huge for me and continuing so. A year ago I couldn't stand him but I was determined to get to the limit of why I felt that way. Here is an excellent video sermon by him that I think will be a transforming help for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UiNneN4oh0 entitled "Why Does God Allow so Much Suffering and Evil?" MacArthur is a powerful, perceptive, 5th generation preacher/theologian. There's books, videos, podcasts. Once I got started on them I'm now hooked with the stimulating light that I believe he's gifted with. Stand and fight. It'll be worth it. Charles | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1384 Registered: 2-2011 |
The link I am providing I hope will be of help to anyone who has ever struggled with the book of 'Job'! myself included ! I believe the teacher at this site is trustworthy. He made clear to me what the message of Job really is and how it is timeless. When you reach the site scroll to the bottom of the page and click on 'Commentaries'~ there you will find his teaching on Job, as well as other 'books' of Scripture. http://www.raystedman.org ~mj~ | ||
| Philharris Registered user Username: Philharris Post Number: 3016 Registered: 5-2007 |
MJ, Since I personally knew Ray C. Stedman back in the days when I lived in the Bay Area and he was still alive, I can say amen to what you've said about him and his clear biblical understanding of Scripture. Whenever I need clarification and understanding of the meaning of Scripture, his online commentary (his written-out sermon notes) is one of the places I turn to. Fearless Phil | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1385 Registered: 2-2011 |
Phil~The 'Fearless'~ I want to "Thank-you" for your introducing me to the teaching of Ray C. Steadman. You did so in referencing him in one of your 'posts', I think, quite sometime ago. Be that as it may, I was so impressed by his Biblical explanation of the 'Word', I searched out his site and have been receiving his 'Free' Daily Devotional ever since! I also make use of his other teachings on a variety of subjects. What a Blessing for you to have been acquainted with him personally! ~mj~ | ||
| Joyfulheart Registered user Username: Joyfulheart Post Number: 958 Registered: 10-2006 |
Pnoga, faith is not blind. It is based on truth - something solid. God has given so much proof of himself, of Jesus, of the end times. Faith also comes from hearing the hearing the Word of God. Please don't leave. Please keep seeking truth. I'm confident you'll find it in Jesus. | ||
| Mountaingirl Registered user Username: Mountaingirl Post Number: 69 Registered: 8-2013 |
Panoga- I just wanted to tell you to hang in there. I only renounced Adventism 15 months ago. In that time frame I have learned a lot and been surprised over how ignorant I really am when it comes to understanding and knowing what God's word actually says and means. When I was young (now 62) faith was simple I just simply believed and trusted God all within the Adventist doctrinal understanding that is. Bad things happened and I just moved on knowing there was no rhyme or reason but still I trusted then a really horrible thing happened and I have struggled with faith and trust ever since. Not so much over the reality of God but more in the personal walking with God. Then I discovered the cross, grace, redemption and faith and while still a struggle it is settled more on what God’s says then how I feel about things in general. I think that somehow in all the works to be perfect and to keep the law perfectly we never knew relationship nor trust to just accept what God’s word says for what it is. I think there will be many many things in which we have no answers for, at least for now, but still the relationship is the main thing with trust and faith which grows as I have come to know what God’s word says and who he actually is and what he actually accomplished for each of us who give our lives to him. Here is something that was in my head for a couple years before I discovered Jesus and came out of SDAism. I was in a really bad place and had just given up completely on God. Job didn’t curse God but I certainly did and ask him to leave me alone because I was so tired of it all, all the work, all the perfectionism, all the lies from some SDA professional people, all the of everything to do with God. The bible to me had become a joke that is because I saw it as something God put together that on one hand was supposed to be simple and on the other hand too hard to do (live it). Work to be this perfect law keeping person and in the end still not know if I was good enough to live for eternity. Too hard to become perfect and love everyone no matter who or what they had done. I loathed the Sabbath day and saw so many inconsistencies in how the other Adventists treated it. In my head for a couple years was this, “If Israel could not “get it” all that time they lived with Moses, had God right there in “their face” with all those huge miracles over and over again, how the * was I supposed to get it, understand it and live it”? And it was with this that I wanted God to leave me alone and let me be free to just breath and live whatever kind of life I could have right now and the after I didn’t care, I didn’t want to care. God had other plans as you can see since I am here. My faith may not be perfect or as grand as some, but I do know this that God has chosen me right where I am with the little feeble faith and trust I can muster and He will show me himself because he has and His word is sure. He is trust worthy rather I can see it, feel it or even at times know it. So I just keep on walking, learning, throwing out the SDAism and finding the real truth of who God is and what he has done for me and can do in me. I am finding that God’s word is wonderful because it now makes sense to me when I read it. The more I hear sermons of good solid Bible teaching and believing Christians the more I understand and with the understanding the more I trust God. I am finding relationship with God, how very much He loves us (I never understood how much God loved us in SDAism). There is relationship with God through His word now; not perfection and it is relationship that will give me complete trust and faith which will grow. Perfectionism gives one nothing but heartache and defeat. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 14776 Registered: 12-2003 |
Thank you, Mountaingirl. Paul, I couldn't grapple with those questions about God's justice and His destruction of the world in a flood and in the slaying of people, either, until I realized that our life on earth now is not "the end". People do not cease to exist when they die. Those who trust God are in a "very much better" state after they die (Phil. 1:22-23). Those who do not trust God similarly do not cease to exist, but their existence is out of fellowship with God. Sometimes the death of the wicked protects those who would be their victims here, but either way, death is not the end. The story of Job troubled me in that, while God gave Job twice as many animals as he lost, he merely "replaced" his ten lost children. And at that...Job didn't have those ten children. But one day I realized: those ten children were not gone! When they died in that windstorm, they did not cease to exist. So, when Job finally did die, he was restored to those ten children. Now, in God's presence, he is with all 20 of his children. If humans were simply snuffed out for an undetermined length of time, God's justice on earth would seem cruel and capricious. Knowing, however, that no one ceases to exist, that God receives His own into His presence and personally deals with the unbelievers upon their death, it all looks different to me. God actually sent His own eternal Son to BECOME (not simply to bear as a representative) the sin of humanity (2 Cor 5:21). He took into Himself the suffering of our wounds and of our sins, and He endured the wrath of God so we won't have to. Knowing that, He doesn't seem capricious and cruel any longer. He has taken into Himself the curse of our sin, and He paid the infinite price of our sin Himself. He, not we who believe, has personally suffered and paid for our personal sins. That God is not capricious. He is merciful. Colleen |
