| Author | Message | ||
| Cloudwatcher Registered user Username: Cloudwatcher Post Number: 637 Registered: 5-2009  |
As you know, the whole premise of the IJ is to prove a true believer's innocence to the "watching worlds." Do Adventists ever stop to ask themselves, ARE THERE WATCHING WORLDS? Where exactly does this come from? Whether there are or aren't isn't the issue for me... my point is, WE DON'T KNOW...and at the very least, one should not base their theology around an assumption. I read this in an Adult SS lesson and I am a little shocked that grown, educated, otherwise intelligent people don't stop to question this from a biblical standpoint. No where in Scripture do I see God telling us to act right for the "watching worlds." **** We are not alone in the universe. An evocative statement for some; dismissed out of hand by others. Some individuals state, without doubt or hesitation, that science strongly supports ex t r a t e rrestrial contacts; others recollect personal contact with ex t r a t e rrestrials through actual alien abductions. These alleged encounters are generally described as highly traumatic, phy s i c a l ly and mentally damaging, and frightening b eyond imagination. Is any of this possible—could it be true? The answer lies in the story of the great controversy, which is pivotal to Seventh-day Adventist belief. Satan began his earthly odyssey as a result of his failed attempt to bring about division in heaven. He was thrown out of heaven along with those angels who chose to follow him, and they were confined to this planet, and this one alone. Is it conceivable that God would permit Satan to spread his evil to other sinless worlds, or that they, in turn, would wish to visit this sad little planet? We know that other sinless worlds in the universe watch the drama of good versus evil play out to the final act. These other worlds review the events as they unfold, because they are, and will continue to be, witnesses to the results of rebellion. Yet, regardless of how majestic the flight of the space shuttle is or the engineering brilliance of the international space station, space exploration will be confined according to God’s master plan. Imagine how wonderful our existence would have been if our planet had not fallen into Lucifer’s evil hands! Think of the complete joy other worlds experience because of their sinless state. Doesn’t it make you long for our heavenly journey home? Rather than debate with nonbelievers about extraterrestrial visitations here on earth or in outer space, share with them the certainty of future fellowship with other intelligent beings when heaven becomes our home and this earth is made new again. Let those searching for truth know why you’re absolutely certain we are not alone in the universe! **** I'm interested in your thoughts. I'm also wondering if you've ever heard an evangelical talking about life in other planets (as a given...with certaintly...as biblical truth). | ||
| Doc Registered user Username: Doc Post Number: 729 Registered: 2-2003  |
Hi Cloudwatcher, As an Evangelical, and never-been SDA, I have never heard any teaching about ETs on the basis of the Bible, lots of speculation, opinions, etc., but that is all. As far as concrete evidence is concerned, either Biblical or scientific, there isn't any. We have now sent probes to the planets in our own solar system, and all of them are uninhabited and totally hostile to life. Even the most likely candidates: Venus is too hot, with an atmosphere of carbon dioxide and sulphuric acid vapour, has a runaway greenhouse effect and is the hotest planet in the solar system, besides corroding anything in sight within minutes. Mars is too cold, with no water and a very thin atmosphere, and is completely dead. That alone refutes what Ellen White wrote, because she believed in life on places like Saturn and Jupiter. These are gas giants, which is no way could support life. Of course, it is her writings that SDAs get this stuff from, not the Bible. The SETI programme, after decades of listening, has never received a single message from an intelligent sender in outer space. My own opinion is that there aren't any aliens, no matter how big the universe is, because God made the earth to be inhabited, and the heavens to declare his glory, not to house ETs. Also my own opinion, and according to many UFO researchers, even secular ones, is that the alien encouters are similar to occult phenomena, and therefore, in Biblical terms, probably of demonic origin. In brief :-) Adrian | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 889 Registered: 2-2011  |
Cloudwatcher~ Remember~ where all of the writings of 'egw' originate~?! With this in mind~ ANYTHING~ that is written or taught as true by 'sda's', on hit's 'face', is an elaborate fabrication! ALL means ALL! This my opinion! ~mj~ | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 890 Registered: 2-2011 |
In my experience, NO 'Christian' churches I have attended since leaving adventism, teach that there are 'aliens' watching humans on earth! ~mj~ | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 14246 Registered: 12-2003  |
Delina, Martin Carey wrote a well-researched and documented article, "Are Other Worlds Watching Us?" in the Jan/Feb 2008 issue of Proclamation. You can read it here: http://www.lifeassuranceministries.org/proclamation/2008/1/martincarey.html Colleen | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 9913 Registered: 3-2004  |
In the churches I have attended, since leaving adventism, I have heard only the gospel of Jesus Christ. Have never heard of anyone living on any other world in the universe. That is egw only. | ||
| Cloudwatcher Registered user Username: Cloudwatcher Post Number: 640 Registered: 5-2009 |
Thank you, everyone for your input. That was my hunch, but I wanted to verify. Adrian - thank you for your thorough response. Mjcmcook - Yep. That's right. Colleen, that article has been on my to-read list for quite some time. It's time to read it! Flyinglady-I wouldn't be surprised if EGW stole her "other worlds" theory from someone else...someone's fiction book....the same fiction she instructed her followers not to read. ;) | ||
| Butterfly_poette Registered user Username: Butterfly_poette Post Number: 297 Registered: 5-2011  |
I know that the vision EGW had of Heaven, with 7 mountains nearby came from the apocrypha book of 2 Esdras. I used to love Early Writings because of the visions. Now I am disgusted with it. | ||
| Gcfrankie Registered user Username: Gcfrankie Post Number: 914 Registered: 1-2007 |
I was at bible study when something was brought up about aliens and I told them the EGW story about aliens on other worlds watching us as examples as to why God did not give them their freedom but dictated their life to them. As an sda I did not believe it and certainly do not today. | ||
| Wiredog Registered user Username: Wiredog Post Number: 303 Registered: 8-2010  |
Have any of you seen the writings of Emanuael Swedenborg? Like the vision EGW had of visiting other plants he too wrote about what he saw and that he conversed with other beings on other planets while he was let by his spirit guides to other planets in out Solar System. Specifically his writings "Earths in the Universe, 1758" (http://bit.ly/VO33sI). He predated EGW by a century and his writings originally in Latin were compiled and translated into english in the mid 1800's. We don't suppose EGW lifted from him do we? | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 914 Registered: 2-2011 |
Wiredog~ "Hmmm", he said with a 'raised eyebrow'! ~ Thanks for the 'link', an informative read. ~mj~ | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 14266 Registered: 12-2003 |
I think it's entirely likely that EGW had access to or otherwise knew about Swedenborg. For sure the spirit behind them was the same... Colleen | ||
| Rocky Registered user Username: Rocky Post Number: 51 Registered: 3-2012 |
Please forgive me for going off thread but when you mention Swedenborg, I want to alert those of us that have been involved in 12 step recovery groups that the steps were written by a man married to and influenced by a Swedenborgian and he actively participated in inviting spirits to interact with him- he was a "channelor" and received "knowledge" from a spirit identifying himself as Boniface- all can be found in the organization history- dr bob and bill both participated in spiritualism and the history of their message shares much with the manner in which egw describes her recieving of her message... I liken 12 step groups to being in a bad foster care after being rescued from the street- it may be safer but is still not my Father's house! http://mywordlikefire.com/2008/09/24/seances-spirits-and-12-steps/ | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 917 Registered: 2-2011 |
Rocky~ I have just read the beginning of the information found in your link posted above~ Involvement in the '12 Step Recovery Program' was at one time a help to me, for a three week short term therapy~ After this participation, I transitioned to the, 'Celebrate Recovery' model~ this may be considered by Christians a better alternative, but after several sessions, I realized that 'Full Surrender' to GOD, and HIM, alone, was the true answer. I stopped going to any sessions, and my 'FATHER' in Heaven became my "sponsor"! HE has been Faithful to me~ No relapses! 'Our' FATHER, truly is the 'Healer' of all our diseases! Total 'moment by moment' surrender and relience on HIM is the 'key'~ And, HE is always available, 24/7! Praising HIS Name for Deliverance! ~mj~ | ||
| Rocky Registered user Username: Rocky Post Number: 52 Registered: 3-2012 |
Mj I join you in praising HIS Name for Deliverence! In Him we have been made new! I love that our Father is our "sponsor" and the Holy Spirit is our teacher! Rocky | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 922 Registered: 2-2011 |
Rocky~ Thank-you for your understanding and kind response~ (^_^) ~ ~mj~ |
