| Author | Message | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 5607 Registered: 9-2006  |
On another thread, which I prefer to keep separate, a person asked a question. The question in the thread was: Just how much do you tell others about leaving SDA church? I noticed some of the answers boiled down to” Just let sleeping dogs lie.” One said he even went to camp meeting and preached in their churches and the last thing he was going to do is advertise the fact that he had left. One person said of the Adventist church: they hid their poison in the most delicious of food, all the other cults, had their bottle of poison clearly labeled, but the 7th day Adventist church, their poison came as I said in the most delicious of Food. They offered the man delicious looking food and he ate, and it caused his life to be a living hell for several years. I know someone like that, do you? Said the man, “remains to this day amongst a precious broken people who are still clutching and crying out in the darkness of Adventism, what must I do to be saved? and nobody in Adventism, can tell them? Who will go? No one answered his question. I have been thinking about that question. Who will go tell them if the former doesn’t? Will it be the Mormons, or the JW’s, or the Catholic’s? Will it be the evangelicals? How do they know what to tell them? Seeing that they mix their poison in delicious looking food? Most evangelicals are not even aware of the problem. One time a young man aspired to be a cowboy, and so he went to the rancher and ask for a job, being short handed the rancher put him on and they started the herd for the long trail drive. One evening as all the cowboys were squatting on the ground and eating their beef and beans, the young man announced, “My butt hurts every time I eat!” The rancher, being a kind man said simply, “Son, your squatting with your spurs on.” I wonder how many formers are just sitting and eating and squatting with their spurs on? Jesus said in Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. One person said that he was just going to leave it all up to the Lord and the Holy Spirit to teach them. It looks to me like we got us a Mexican stand off here, because according to Acts 1:8 and other scriptures, Jesus said we were going to be the witnesses to him, we who have received the Spirit, he said this before the Holy Spirit was sent. Since the Evangelicals don’t even know, and the Catholics, the JW’s and the Mormans ain’t got nothing for them even if they did go, then who does that leave? Unless I misunderstood the Holy Spirit, or didn’t even hear the Holy Spirit speaking at all to me, I was told it wouldn’t be me who goes, but the former who will go. Even if I did go, I am only one person. I don’t know what to tell them, how to talk to them. Said Martin Luther King, “I have been to the top of the mountain and I have looked over the other side.” It thrills my soul every time I hear that man say those words, willing to speak even if it cost him his life, and it did. I wonder how many formers have been to the top of the mountain and looked on the other side, gazed out over glory and caught the vision of freedom for their own. Looked back out over the ones that remains to this day amongst a precious broken people who are still clutching and crying out in the darkness of Adventism, what must I do to be saved? Before I came to this forum I didn’t even know there was such a thing as a ‘Former’ and I thought, Oh wow! I am not alone! But some of the words I read greatly disturbed me, words of compromise, words proclaiming the innocence of Adventism, words proclaiming the Christianity of Adventism. I get upset no end when the old sincerity clause is hauled out so you can gloss over it like it was a piece of apple pie. “Go ahead and eat your food son, its laced with poison and its going to kill you, but go right ahead and eat up.” Can’t the former at least tell them the reason their back side is hurting is because they are Squatting with their spurs on? I will be 69 years old this spring, my time left is not much, but I have a vision, I have looked over the other side to the thousands of formers preaching the un-compromised gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ and his new covenant to a people who are still clutching and crying out in the darkness of Adventism, what must I do to be saved? The ones who sacrificed to travel across this land this summer to bring the TOE was just fore runners, but it is getting late, In the day when the keepers of the house shall tremble, and the strong men shall bow themselves, and the grinders cease because they are few, and those that look out of the windows be darkened, And the doors shall be shut in the streets, when the sound of the grinding is low, and he shall rise up at the voice of the bird, and all the daughters of music shall be brought low; Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets: Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. The clock is ticking, awaiting the striking of the chimes. Don’t lets us be squatting with our spurs on. River | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 10485 Registered: 12-2003  |
Thank you, River. Thank you. God has rescued us for the same reason He rescued the apostles—so we would be His witnesses and show those in darkness the Source of light. We really can't keep quiet--unless we have already spoken clearly, and our speaking has been rejected. We have to speak--and God gives us both opportunity and His words. Have courage, my fellow formers! God is our strength! Colleen | ||
| 8thday Registered user Username: 8thday Post Number: 1281 Registered: 11-2007  |
Amen and Amen! | ||
| Doc Registered user Username: Doc Post Number: 435 Registered: 2-2003  |
This issue has been giving me some thought too. I have been trying to talk to JWs recently, who are really active here at the moment, and I am really getting nowhere. I have also listened to testimonies of ex-JWs (from USA, of course), and they seem to be the ones who can best minister to the present ones, as they know the issues intimately. Same as other ex-cultists. At least the evangelicals seem to be waking up to the need to get out there and win the lost now, not just leave the cults to pick all the fruit. This is what we are doing too - holding house meetings and trying to "make disciples". But this issue of cults is just bugging me too. I have never actually come across any ex-cultists here, JW, SDA, Mormon, or anyone, and don't know of any really good apologetics sites. Also, as I have mentioned before, even the "evangelicals" are so legalistic, that I wonder how much of a clue they really have. And, as I have also mentioned, the SDAs have managed to infiltrate so well that no-one seems to think there is anything much wrong with them. Anyway, just thinking aloud. Anyone know any ex-s from Hungary, or nearby? God bless, Adrian | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 5609 Registered: 9-2006 |
No... but I might be able to rope you a couple of them and float them over on a board!  River | ||
| Skeeter Registered user Username: Skeeter Post Number: 390 Registered: 12-2007 |
River, Sqattin with my boots on is kinda how I feel when I try to talk to my SDA Mother in law :-( When I was first learning about the errors in Adventism and sharing those things with her she was willing to listen and even discuss... but now that she knows I have LEFT the "remnant" she does not want to hear any of it. I cant force feed it to her or I will push her away completely. I love the woman dearly and so I will slip in a little nugget of information here and there when the opportunity arises.. but other than that, since she has made it clear that she intends to stay in that system of error,, I dont see that I can do much else except wait and watch for that opportunity, continue to love her and pray that someday the Holy Spirit will bring conviction to her mind and heart. But it does hurt seeing her and so many others still in that false system of belief and wanting to share with them the TRUE Gospel of Christ and knowing so many of them will continue to just make excuses for their false prophet and prefer to keep that veil pulled down over their eyes.It seems it is more like a blindfold since the wearer can see as through a fog with a "veil". Some of these people actually seem to PREFER being totally blind ! Trying to talk truth to them is very much a pain in the rear end... much like squattin with spurs on. I think you should make " Squattin with your spurs on " another story ! Skeeter | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2211 Registered: 8-2004  |
Squattin' with yer spurs on could have some painful consequences to your backside! (always dependin' on which spurs ya got). | ||
| 8thday Registered user Username: 8thday Post Number: 1283 Registered: 11-2007 |
Wish I knew some Doc.. I'd send us.. but we would never learn Hungarian in a million years! lol. One guy I know is blasting American Christianity because he's going to a Mosque to witness and hearing all their genuine criticisms of the false versions of our faith. He's very heavy on holiness and has more or less rebuked me for being too heavy on grace. He thinks the false teachers are all to blame for why these guys are sitting in a mosque learning Islam. However.. I think it's more than that. People really want bondage.. and grace is kind of unfulfilling for people who would love to point to their religious works as amounting to something. Grace does not feed your pride. Whether it's a cult or a legalistic form of Christianity, they all offer the same perk.. works of the flesh. I think that's the common attraction.. imo. Sondra | ||
| Nowisee Registered user Username: Nowisee Post Number: 144 Registered: 5-2009 |
River, your post is very powerful and I thank you for it, too. They (religious leaders)kept telling the apostles to be quiet, threatening them with harm and harming them, but they would not be quiet, no matter what. Something that is simple yet powerful for 'never beens' to ask SDAs is 'Are you saved?' They might actually hear this question from you as they look on you as a non-remnant Christian who doesn't know any better (I can say this cause I did it) and,in spite of themselves, might actually think about it at some time in their life because it will bother them. Just my 2 cents worth... | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 5612 Registered: 9-2006 |
your information is worth a lot more than 2 cents, funny, I never thought of it. I appreciate it. | ||
| 8thday Registered user Username: 8thday Post Number: 1289 Registered: 11-2007 |
I recently asked an old classmate this.. we are in the middle of a rather interesting dialogue on a discussion he started. I just asked him if he had assurance.. did he KNOW he was saved? He says he does, and has come to understand the grace of God. He manages to bend EGW instead of Paul.. to try to make it fit together. I guess that's better than twisting the Word.. but still. Another classmate of ours, also a former and a very strong believer (so happy to find him!!!!!) as been in on the discussion as well.. talking about the IJ and the State of the Dead. Both of us gave him a short version of our testimony of just reading the Word and seeing the truth very simply didn't line up with the church or egw. Praying our other friend can have his eyes opened too. His thinking is very conflicted and he became very upset with me for posting egw quotes. ha. Truth is embarrassing I guess. Sondra | ||
| Lindylou Registered user Username: Lindylou Post Number: 235 Registered: 1-2005  |
I know I'm behind the times on this thread, but I just wanted to add to what Skeeter touched on. I don't have a sense that formers are just sitting around on their haunches in pain. Most of us have discovered that shouting from the mountaintops about Grace and the freedom discovered outside of the cult of SDA-ism, is rather pointless. There's a saying that says something like this: "You can't teach a pig to sing, it can't be done and it only irritates the pig." I'm sure I've misquoted it, but perhaps you get the point. I am more than happy to be available and "on call" to share my story or answer questions, but I've found that unless an Adventist is truly searching for God's truth, that my words will not be heard. I am thankful for those who have shared their story in print or personally, however, it took my own searching to allow me to be open to listen. I feel no guilt for moving on and giving Adventists as a whole no more thought. My energy can be put too more productive use. I am always happy to talk with a person on a quest, at the nudging of the Holy Spirit, but I refuse to stand on a soap box in an attempt to "save" them from their deception. Only the H.S. can do that! | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 5643 Registered: 9-2006 |
You must have took a bitter pill instead of an asperin River | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 799 Registered: 1-2003  |
(smiling) "Most of us have discovered that shouting from the mountaintops about Grace and the freedom discovered outside of the cult of SDA-ism, is rather pointless." I don't find it pointless at all . . . why?? . . . simply because I'm not doing it for any person but as a praise to my Lord and Savior for what He has done for me. If someone "happens" to hear me and be blessed then so much the better. I also don't set out to convince others of error but to simply share the Biblical truth that God is constantly revealing and opening to me as I immerse myself in His Word. Many years of my life were complicated by what I'd been taught. God has called me to the simple truth of the Gospel and the gift of Grace He has given to me. God is calling us each to a higher and higher and deeper and deeper relationship with Him. He is an awesome God and will allow whatever intimacy we are willing to accept with Him. Richard rtruitt@mac.com . | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 5644 Registered: 9-2006 |
The simple truth of what Richard has said touches my heart. It reminds me of the story starting in John 9:1 where Jesus heals a man who has been blind from birth. The man tells them, "One thing I know: that though I was blind, now I see." Part of this conversation also reminds me of some scripture in the Bible in Luke 17:13 where Jesus has come into a village and there are ten lepers who cannot approach because of their dreadful disease, so they call to him from afar off. Jesus heals them all, and later one man comes back and with a loud voice glorifies God. I suppose the men went to clear themselves with a priest. Jesus asks, "Where are the other nine?" When I was an alcoholic , I was looked down on pretty much as a hopeless case. "He's not worth spit, just a drunk." But there was one woman who had answered the call of God. I was a pretty sad case when she came to my house, sitting there in a drunken stupor, family in abject poverty, but she looked past all that, and she prayed for me that Friday night. I wasn't looking for the truth, I was so drunk, it was a relief when she left, and what was on my mind was to spend the few precious dollars that needed to go to the support of my family, to buy another bottle of Vodka. On Saturday I poured out my remaining liquor and went and paid my bar bill and on Sunday I went to church, that was 38 years ago, and I have never taken even one sip of booze since that time. No, they aren't looking for truth, they think they have the truth, those that are born blind do not know anything but the darkness of what they have been taught. But who will go and pray? Who will wade amongst the stink and poverty of their lives to pray? No guilt, no soap box, just a willingness to go and pray, glorifying God in our hearts. A perfectly logical question could be ask, “Why couldn’t the woman have just staid home and prayed from there?” I don’t know. There is just something about God that he desires to walk out among the people. We see in Acts 1:8 "But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." The end of the earth pretty much covers anywhere we might set foot. River | ||
| Hec Registered user Username: Hec Post Number: 650 Registered: 3-2009 |
How difficult it is to explain light to one born blind! Even after their eyes are opened a bit,they still see through their own glasses. Lord help us! Hec | ||
| Skeeter Registered user Username: Skeeter Post Number: 414 Registered: 12-2007 |
I agree that those who are willing and able and feel called by God to do so should certainly "shout from the house tops". Personally I am not a skilled speaker, I often get confused, start talking and forget mid sentence what I planned to say... So I have found that for me personally, while God does at times impress me to speak to others about Him, I have found that I am more able to reach those around me not with a shout, but a whisper. I am thankful for those who are able to shout His truth... some people need to hear loudly what He is trying to tell them... but I feel God can and will use all of His children to spread His truth, just not all in the same way. :-) I may only be able to reach a very few with a small voice, but my hope and my prayer is that He will use me to reach a few of those that cannot be reached any other way. :-) Francie | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 7627 Registered: 3-2004  |
The way I understand God is, He will call people to be a Saul/Paul and others, like in the churches Paul established, to work where they are. God is using me right where I am to let others know what adventism believes. He provides opportunities to speak out right where I am and I am so thankful He choses to use me right here. If He wants me to go else where He will let me know. Diana L |
