| Author | Message | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 844 Registered: 11-2005 |
The truth is the road to freedom. Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 162 Years, 11 Months, and 3 Days since October 22, 1844 | ||
| Zjason Registered user Username: Zjason Post Number: 83 Registered: 11-2005  |
Alfred Hitchcock was right! "God will not smell in their assemblies."? I'm not for sure I understand this... Jason | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1530 Registered: 9-2006  |
Genesis 8:20 And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar. Genesis 8:21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done. I guess this is what she was referring too, of course the Lord took her into his confidence since she was so much the more righteous than all them other church goers. River | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 845 Registered: 11-2005 |
Ellen White could have profited from selling "magic glasses". The truth is the road to freedom. Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 162 Years, 11 Months, and 3 Days since October 22, 1844 | ||
| Randyg Registered user Username: Randyg Post Number: 480 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hey Gilbert, I am curious as to where these quotes might be found. It is pretty amazing as I, nor I am sure, most Adventists have ever heard this nonsense before. Yet again words from "a continuing and authoritative source of truth". Might I suggest a collective sigh? As always Gilbert, informative, incredible, and mainly bewildering! Randy | ||
| Jeremiah Registered user Username: Jeremiah Post Number: 290 Registered: 1-2004  |
The sad thing about pointing out that "God is not in their thoughts;" and "they decorate their poor mortal bodies, and then look upon themselves with satisfaction and pleasure" is that someone who reads this and tries to prove that "God is in their thoughts" by taking off the jewelry can get into judging people based on outward appearance. Holiness becomes defined by the level of outward decoration of a person. This can foster a prideful "holier than thou" attitude without the person even realizing it. Jeremiah | ||
| Agapetos Registered user Username: Agapetos Post Number: 1063 Registered: 10-2002  |
Very, very true Jeremiah. Trying to "prove" by removing jewelry is no better than wearing a typical world's view of adorned happiness. In fact, the sad part is that it's likely more deceived than the worldly version. About the EGW quote, it seems that she was thinking of the last part of Revelation 20 -- In context, the passage is talking about the coming of Christ (King of kings) and His defeating the world which somehow thinks it has a chance against Him. From this passage, it seems that the "birds" are concurrent with His final overthrowing of the world (and a measure of 'judgment' because the beast & false prophet go from here straight to the lake of burning sulfur). ANYWAY, Ellen seems to think that these "birds" are demons, but we can't definitively say that from Scripture. It seems rather that she was attempting to make some prophetic link to the state of churches in her day using the prophetic language of Scripture. The great irony is that she was condemning churches that clung to the gospel instead of accepting aberrant teachings. In this case, sadly, her choice words turn back on her. An interesting link to the language of Revelation 20 can be found in Luke 17, the famous "one will be taken and another will be left" which is often interpreted without reading the final question & answer in the passage: The question "where" they'll be taken is answered by referring to the vultures taking them away. It's parallel to Revelation 20 which speaks of that great gathering of birds to gorge themselves on the flesh of those who stand against God. The interesting detail Jesus adds is the description of those whom the vultures take. He describes them as "a dead body." What can this mean but that in God's sight they are not alive? They live by their dead works. Although they appear to be alive, inside they are like rotting carcasses, and in the end their destiny is with the birds. Added up, then, who is inviting the birds? Isn't it Adventism with its turning away from justification by faith and replacing it with justification & sanctification by works? | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 846 Registered: 11-2005 |
Randyg, I am glad that you noticed that! I try to always include both the reference and the context. I just overlooked it on this one. This quote comes from Early Writings, page 274. Early Writings has some real doozies! The truth is the road to freedom. Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 162 Years, 11 Months, and 3 Days since October 22, 1844 | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6876 Registered: 12-2003  |
Amazing, Gilbert. And interesting insights, Ramone. Colleen | ||
| Cathy2 Registered user Username: Cathy2 Post Number: 277 Registered: 2-2006 |
Gilbert, I have often wondered what it must be and feel like for an individual to be so extremely self-rightous over everyone else. To me, it places their insecurities in neon lights. Yet, because Ellen and, now a days, SDa's are so filled with self-righteousness, I find it hard to feel compassion for their willful blindness, even though I know I was born and raised in the same attitudes. God help me to forgive and pray for them. Most of the time I want nothing to do with them and their condemnations on the rest of Christianity. 'Whited seplucures', full of inward stench, repels me, no matter what the source is (SDA or not). I just hate it; God help me. Cathy | ||
| Honestwitness Registered user Username: Honestwitness Post Number: 332 Registered: 7-2005  |
At the SDA church I attend with my husband, we had a discussion group last weekend. The pastor started off by asking the question, "What have you learned about God this week?" I opened my Bible, ready to talk about something I had seen in a passage, but several other hands went up, so the pastor acknowledged them first. Most of the people in the group were women, and one by one, each one shared an experience from the past week. One woman was so happy that God had made sure she got a coupon in the mail that enabled her to get a discount on membership in a fitness center. Several other women spoke about similar types of things and then one woman shared how someone had come up to her that week and asked, "Are you a Christian?" She responded, "Yes, how did you know?" The person told her it was because she was wearing a dress. This woman stated that she was so happy that, by wearing a dress and no make-up, other people could tell she was a Christian. She said she was so glad we could all witness for God this way. I looked around the room and saw that about half the women were wearing slacks and make-up, as was I. I should have said something like, "Yes, and if all these men would quit shaving and quit wearing their ties, they could witness for Christ, too!" * sigh * I'm so glad I have found a wonderful Sunday church, where the classes and discussion groups actually study the BIBLE! Each week, as I sit in the SDA church with hubby and cringe at the things I hear and see, I console myself by the thought that tomorrow I can go where there is a fresh breeze of the Holy Spirit and deep respect for the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Honestwitness | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1533 Registered: 9-2006 |
For the sake of love they have become my friends, but for the sake of the Gospel they have become my enemies. This, at first glance, seems such a dualistic statement, and yet it is the only words I can come up with to explain my association with them. I don’t personally have the love and compassion for them, in myself I do not possess the ability, God must first pour his own love into me in order for me to have love for them, I have to depend on that every day I get up. Yesterday’s portion is not enough, I must ask God for a new portion each and every day, the situation reminds me of the Manna. The situation also reminds me of the scripture in Matthew 18:21-35. Through Gods great mercy I was delivered from years of alcoholism and I hate drinking because of what it did to me and yet I have a flesh and blood brother whom I must love and pray for who continues to drink himself into a stupor. Love is not a choice we have as Christians, we can’t just opt out. Can we afford to be like one who has been raised in poverty, then given great riches only to use the power of our wealth for selfish reasons and look with disdain on the ones who still live in poverty? Can we really afford that? Paul says that without it we become as a tinkling brass, I am reminded of when I worked in the boat yards as a shipwright, the halyards and chains tinkling and slapping upon dozens of aluminum mast in the breeze would get on my nerves before the end of the day, but my love of boats and sail overcame that irritation. Christ love poured into us can overcome the irritation but we must have it daily, the love we had yesterday is like a yesterday’s newspaper, nobody wants it. The love of yesterdays seems to sift through my fingers like sand and it must constantly be replenished. River | ||
| Gcfrankie Registered user Username: Gcfrankie Post Number: 47 Registered: 1-2007 |
Talk about talking out of two sides of their mouths! On the one hand the SDA say there are God's people in other churches but deep down they condemn them and are told not to associate with them as they are harlots out of the Sunday churches. Jesus tells us it is not what goes into our mouth that condemn us but what comes out of our mouths. He also tells us that we will get a new body at the resurrection. It is what is in our heart (love of Jesus and his gospel) and not our body as it is temporary. Who is EGW to judge others about their relationship with Jesus? That does not mean that we are to abuse our bodies. The bible tells us in Genesis 3:19ff, for you are dust and to dust you shall return. I was not raised SDA but joined later and it was not until the last couple of years that I started reading her works because everyone at church was always refering to her and it really started me thinking. I was raised in a presbyterian church as a child and was taught that you never place anyones writing above the word of God. During my readings Jesus hit me between the eyes showing me that she has placed herself above Him in her writings. She said she didn't but to me she protested toooo loudly. I was not even taught how to study the bible but only to pick and choose, so I am having to learn how to really study and what a great and joyful blessing! One of my favorite books is Galations as it keeps me grounded from falling back into the same trap as before. As Diane says "God is Awesome" and keeps us grounded in His word. May God bless everyone and keep his loving arms around us. Gail | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 777 Registered: 6-2006  |
The more I read some of these writings, the more I get the impression that Ellen had quite a God complex. I would just like to know how she knew what was in other people's hearts. And how she knew what Jesus was thinking, and how God looked upon other people. How did she know unless she were God herself? Creepy, Rediculous, Awful, and Pathetic! It makes me so angry. Leigh Anne | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6882 Registered: 12-2003 |
I read your acronym, Leigh Anne. And I completely empathize with your reaction. River, thank you for your reflections on needing God to pour His love into our hearts. I was really impacted by your last paragraph: "Christ love poured into us can overcome the irritation but we must have it daily, the love we had yesterday is like a yesterday’s newspaper, nobody wants it. The love of yesterdays seems to sift through my fingers like sand and it must constantly be replenished. " That is so true—and it is only by submitting myself and my words to the Lord Jesus every day--sometimes hour by hour--that I have any hope of not being overcome by feelings of futility , exhaustion, and hopelessness. God does ask us to love them for Him--and that love maybe a call to accountability or an invitation to lunch. I'm thankful that the battle is His—and that He is faithful. Colleen |
