| Author | Message | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 663 Registered: 11-2005 |
Here is another amazing quote from Early Writings, page 39 How interesting! I wonder what happens if an angel looses his golden card? So they have to present them in order to get out, and also to get back in? Under what circumstances is an angel refused the opportunity to exit the city by these "guard" angels? Who issues the golden cards? What purpose do they serve -- to keep the evil angels from being able to get in or out of the city? Do they only apply to angels traveling to and from the earth? Yes. "A continuing and authoritative source of truth." Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Agapetos Registered user Username: Agapetos Post Number: 1014 Registered: 10-2002  |
Bizarre. | ||
| Raven Registered user Username: Raven Post Number: 811 Registered: 7-2004  |
Surely there must be a symbolic meaning to that quote rather than literal--that has to be the key to understanding what she meant. Maybe it's like the seal of God in the forehead or the mark of the beast which are symbolic but not literal. I've read that quote several times before as an SDA, but don't recall ever thinking through the absurdity of it, or what it could mean if not literal. I guess when you hear bizarre things all your life, you just accept them without a thought. It looks so much stranger now that I'm out. | ||
| Pnoga Registered user Username: Pnoga Post Number: 19 Registered: 1-2007 |
And Satan's counterfeit to that... <drum roll.............> The Master Card, which everyone can get in debt but not out.... LOL! | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 664 Registered: 11-2005 |
To be symbolic, what she says about the people, commandments, earth as a world, the Sabbath, etc would have to also be symbolic. (I wonder if that would make the Heavenly Sanctuary symbolic? Hey! Maybe we are getting somewhere now!) She always includes herself in the various scenes in a physical way, eg the children with wings flying around like butterflies to other places. She sees a group with a red stripe on their garments, asks what that means, and is told those were people killed for keep the commandments. Evidently none of the "Advent band" were among them, because in Ellen's "visions" they were always with her (or she was with them) -- many times in a "perfect square". By the way, the "perfect square" must have been just the outside of the group because 144,000 (of which she said she was a part) does not have a squareroot that is a whole number! She often describes the "saints" as "marching" but they must not have been in formation... I wonder if the "guard" angels have to "work" on Sabbath, or if everything shuts down. Perhaps it is alright to do some types of "work" on Sabbath in Heaven, but not others? Perhaps they have a tithing system in heaven too? (I can imagine Dennis Fischer rolling his eyes over that one. <smile>) Also, why a gold card? Gold is not worth much in heaven. Even the streets of the Holy City are gold. And why a card. Perhaps there are so many angels coming and going to earth, especially since (according to adjacent visions) each human being has at least one guardian angel, and if that one has to leave the person they are supposed to be guarding for some reason, another one is sent from heaven to take their place. I wonder if an angel is a "guard" angel, if they are one "for life"? Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Patriar Registered user Username: Patriar Post Number: 357 Registered: 3-2005 |
I'm ashamed to say that early on, when we'd left the Adventist church, my husband and I were attempting to tell our children the significance of who Jesus is. I remember telling them, "He's like a golden ticket into heaven." Now, I know there's truth to that in a childlike, simplistic way, but I was abhorred to find recently that likely my thoughts came from this quote of Ellen's! Bizarre is right! Patria (Message edited by patriar on August 31, 2007) | ||
| Larry Registered user Username: Larry Post Number: 131 Registered: 5-2007 |
Gilbert, The reason you don't understand her writings is because you are taking them out of context, don't you know she had PLENARY inspiration??  Someone spewed "plenary inspiration" at me one day, having got the term freshly from a White Summit, so I looked it up. It meant "without defect". Wonderful. That really does reverse all the criticism! We don't know why she said gold cards, but someday we will know, right? The streets in heaven are of gold, so these angel cards are the equivalent of what? Road tar? haha (Message edited by larry on August 31, 2007) | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6694 Registered: 12-2003  |
I remember having moments, as we were awakening from our more-than-four-decade Adventist thrall, of realizing I couldn't depend anymore on some of those tangible, "comforting" descriptions of heaven I had always thought might be true. During the years I began to think Ellen wasn't "all that" but hadn't tossed her completely, I sort-of picked and chose the things she said that I could hang onto because they might be so, after all! When I finally had to admit she was a false prophet (as opposed to not-a-prophet), I realized I had to let all that go. I guess I'll just have to live with the Bible's promise that eye has not seen nor ear heard the things that God has prepared for us! At first it's kind of disappointing to let go of those "comforting" physical descriptions, y'know? But hey, I now live with a certain hope of things far more and better than Ellen promised! How amazing is that?! Colleen PS--By the way, Gilbert, I'm loving these quotes your finding. It's actually helpful. I'm realizing increasingly how much everything that shaped my worldview was derived from Ellen, even when I didn't know or remember her specific words. But everything I was taught as an Adventist came through her paradigm and definitions. It's kind of shocking, actually--I believed in a false prophet, and I had no clue what was actually real! Praise God for Jesus and His faithfulness to teach us His word! (Message edited by Colleentinker on August 31, 2007) | ||
| Asurprise Registered user Username: Asurprise Post Number: 192 Registered: 7-2007 |
Oh no Gilbert! Only the Adventists have to rest on the Sabbath - everybody else works! (Just kidding  | ||
| Snowboardingmom Registered user Username: Snowboardingmom Post Number: 326 Registered: 11-2005 |
Ha, Pnoga!!! That's great. Package of Ballpark hotdogs: $3 Cup of coffee at Starbucks: $5 Bottle of Merlot: $48 Pair of gold earrings: $60 The freedom to enjoy these things in Christ: Priceless... Some things money can't buy, or "certain" Church membership can't give... Grace | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4230 Registered: 3-2004  |
Hey, because heaven is heaven maybe it is ahead of us earthlings and that is the computer pass they stick in the door to open it. ) Diana | ||
| Olga Registered user Username: Olga Post Number: 81 Registered: 11-2005 |
The Angel Express Gold Card: "Don't leave" (heaven) "without it." | ||
| Olga Registered user Username: Olga Post Number: 82 Registered: 11-2005 |
Colleen you wrote: "I guess I'll just have to live with the Bible's promise that eye has not seen nor ear heard the things that God has prepared for us!" It is amazing that I knew the Bible did say exactly what you just said, but still I believed all the stuff EGW wrote about heaven in her supposed journeys there. That verse should be added as proof that EGW was indeed NOT God's true prophet! | ||
| Larry Registered user Username: Larry Post Number: 136 Registered: 5-2007 |
John the Revelator speaks of things of heaven. We can read Revelation and believe what it says. But this golden card thing is another form of adding to Revelation. We just cannot get enough Revelation 22:18: I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book | ||
| Lordsanointed Registered user Username: Lordsanointed Post Number: 11 Registered: 8-2007 |
She copied this "vision" from Wiliam Foy.
I was reading about her books(copied) and I remembered this topic. Here we can see more: http://www.ellenwhite.org/refute9a.htm | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 795 Registered: 11-2005 |
Lordsanointed, you are doing some good research! Thank you so much for the references. The (true) story of William Foy is a fascinating one. The boldness with which Ellen claimed she saw in vision what he said earlier -- and did it in public in a meeting he was at -- is really brazen! Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 162 Years, 10 Months, and 23 Days since October 22, 1844 |
