| Author | Message | ||
| Jim02 Registered user Username: Jim02 Post Number: 168 Registered: 5-2007 |
I have been attending church as a visitor at my oldest sons new church for a couple months now, usually every other week. I attend mostly to encourage my son, but also because I am looking for a church to call home. It is an Assembly of God. A pentecostal type place. Warm, gentle Christian people. They have styles and beliefs that do not match my own 100%. I took the advice of Colleen, River and others collectively, and decided nit picking was not an answer either. So I go. I "NEED" the spiritual refueling. I observe: I watch, I participate in the worship service, sing some, pray. I don't raise my hands in the air. Not comfortable with that......... I have cried a few times. Don't always know why. Sometimes , it's me. Sometimes I share another's moment from across the room, sometimes it's the music. They have this worship music there that is softly rythmatic and emotional. It tends to set the mood and inspire centering. I don't care for the drums. They seem out of place. Anyway, Today, again, 2nd time now. Someone spoke in tongues. This time it was less mathmatical in construct (at least to my impression) It was gutteral and loud. A man spoke it for about 30 seconds. Then a woman a few seconds later spoke english, praying outloud that she wanted to be heard in her prayers. So I am not sure if she interpreted the man or it was simply her own prayer. The church remained silent for about another minute, the glow of the lights set the atmosphere of a soft golden moment. The air was cool and the room was strangely quite. I felt calmness and those tears crept back. Just don't know what to make of this. Never seen this in a SDA setting. In SDA, we are too intelectual, too many check lists and I suspect we miss the moments more often than not. These people are emotional and simple in their worship. Not hysterical at all. But emotional, engaged, and simply connected to the moment. What's going on here?????? I think no matter what the future choices are. I have experienced another facet of worship and I am learning God has many sheep not of this fold. It's been a good day. Thank You Father | ||
| Bigal Registered user Username: Bigal Post Number: 78 Registered: 9-2006  |
Jim, When I was in grade school I occasionally got into a fight. It was inevitable that I would cry during or just after the fight was broken up. I could not understand why I did this. When I left the SDA church and began to attend a Bible fellowship church I frequently cried during the service (music and or sermon induced). Again I found myself confused by the emotion that overtook me. I have now been out of Adventism about 9 years, but only really attending a fellowship (church) for about 3 to 4 years now. I cry less, but think that I now recognize that it is the presence of the Holy Spirit in the worship service that brings me to cry. I don't fully understand it all yet, but am much more comfortable than I use to be. You know, big boys don't cry. Like you, I find raising my hands difficult in church. I’ve kept my emotions in check either because it is not what men do or what Adventist do. Thank God I can freely relearn to worship with my whole being. Last week I took up the offering and served to hand out the elements for communion. I had the opportunity to stand at the back of the church and felt free to raise both hand when I was moved by worship. I am letting go little by little the old taboos. Alan | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4063 Registered: 3-2004  |
Jim, I am so glad you are attending you son's church every other week. God is teaching you all kinds of things and He will continue to do so. Just stay connected to Him. I am sure I really do not have to say that. I cry also at times during the service and music. I also can raise my hands in song now. God is making progress with me. He is so awesome. Diana Bigal, If you ever get into Little Rock go to the Bible Fellowship church. That is where my daughter in law and son go with their son. Diana | ||
| Bigal Registered user Username: Bigal Post Number: 79 Registered: 9-2006 |
Thank you Diana, I am am always looking for a good church to visit when I am away from home. We get to Little Rock occassionally throughout the year. Alan | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6419 Registered: 12-2003  |
Jim, I am so thankful for what you are experiencing in church. The peace, the calmness--even the tears--those are from God. God heals us by His Spirit in our spirits. 1 Corinthians 12-14 give guidelines for orderly worship including tongues, words of prophecy, etc. These things are not necessary for deep worship, but at the same time the Bible allows for them. The biblical description helps you judge whether or not a service is following a biblical model. If you are praying to know the truth, if you are open to God directing and leading you, you can praise Him and worship Him and learn from Him and His word wherever He directs you. It sounds as if your going to this church with your son is something God has orchestrated to bring healing and bonding into your relationship with him and also to begin to heal your own emotions and heart. Indeed, Adventism kept us in our heads. God wants to heal our emotions, and one of the things He does is to surprise us with His presence in a deep place in our hearts where we can feel Him and His cleansing and calming touch, but where we can't verbally explain exactly what's going on. Those tears are an evidence of the Holy Spirit at work in you. As God heals our emotions and slowly "wakes us up" to the truth about our own lives, He miraculously connects our feelings with our minds, giving us perception and wisdom and insight through His Spirit as we submit to His truth and reality. God is so at work in you, Jim. I'll bet your wife sees a difference! Colleen | ||
| Stevendi Registered user Username: Stevendi Post Number: 187 Registered: 10-2006 |
Colleen, That is beautiful, and absolutely true. It has been so refreshing to experience God directly the last 3 years, instead of trying to define and box Him through a false prophet. steve | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 482 Registered: 11-2005 |
I talked with our Baptist pastor Sunday about Adventism. He had an interesting insight. He feels that Adventism in general lacks conviction. He finds the difference between Adventism and Mormonism to be striking. He said Mormons generally feel a deep sense of conviction, whether they follow that or not. When they leave Mormonism, the process is significantly different than leaving Adventism. As a result there is a significant level of animosity in both directions. He said it seems to him like Adventism is rooted more in a cultural framework where they will focus on prophecy, and other esoteric subjects, without actually spending much time on the emotional underpinnings of their relationship with Christ and each other. I thought that was very perceptive. Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 483 Registered: 11-2005 |
Jim, I also experienced that. I have noticed, for example, that my tears come from realizing that the experience is real, instead of going through all the false pretenses that we went through as Adventists. When I was an Adventist, I knew from about age 13 that there was absolutely no way that I could be perfect enough to ever make it to heaven. Combine that with Ellen White's emotionally suicidal statements such as:
On the one hand we would keep telling ourselves that "We have the truth, and all other denominations are lost. We are the Remnant Church. We are THE people with a special message to a lost world -- anyone who is a non-Adventist. Isn't it wonderful to be a Seventh-day Adventist!" Deep down in our hearts we know that is a blatant lie. Our whole life is a deception. We have all been living a lie, and to finally, finally, be at peace with ourselves, and internalize that: 1. God does love us just the way we are. We are His children! 2. We ARE saved, and NO ONE can take that away! 3. There is no such thing as a "Close of Probation", and God DOES say, "I will NEVER" leave you, nor forsake you." 4. The whole 1844/Investigate Judgment story is one collosal farce without any Biblical basis, a "false gospel" that robs its recipients of full meaning of the unfathomable gift of Jesus's shed blood by postponing the completion of His sacrifice until 1844. 5. Our neighbors are NOT going to be hunting us down to kill us during some mythical Universal Sunday Law when we have to "flee to the mountains". Contrary to the false teachings of Ellen White, the Catholic Church is not behind every conspiracy. 6. We have been taught so many falsehoods from Ellen White that at times we aren't sure what came from the Bible and what came from her. After becoming a Christian we find ourselves learning the basics all over again. 7. It is not about our inadequacies and failing to "properly" keep the Seventh-day Sabbath. It is all about true Sabbath Rest in Jesus -- the real Sabbath. It is no wonder that this realization reduces us to tears. We are FINALLY realizing that we no longer have to live a life of self-deception. Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6428 Registered: 12-2003 |
So well said, Gilbert: "It is no wonder that this realization reduces us to tears. We are FINALLY realizing that we no longer have to live a life of self-deception." Praise God, is all I can say! It's overwhelming. Colleen | ||
| Asurprise Registered user Username: Asurprise Post Number: 90 Registered: 7-2007 |
My favorite texts are Ephesians 2:8,9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast." (Other texts that say the same are 2 Tim. 1:9 & Titus 3:5) The funny thing is, is that while I was an Adventist, I didn't notice any of the contradictions with the Bible, or anything else wrong with the church. It took another person two years of fasting and prayer before she was able to finally point out something that made me question. Then I started finding contradictions right and left! Dianne |
