| Author |
Message |
Reb
Registered user
Username: Reb
Post Number: 112
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 11:13 am: |     |
The Seventh Day Baptists do believe the 10 commandments are still binding on Christians, from what I understand, yes. However, the other Old Testament Laws, food laws, etc. are NOT binding on Christians. However, as I said the Seventh Day Baptists do NOT consider the Sababth to be the seal of God like the Adventists do and do NOT judge Christians who worship on Sunday or consider them lost. There is room for "individual liberty of conscience" which the SDAs do not have. There is no IJ or any other SDA nonsense. The only thing is yes, they do believe all 10 commandments are still binding on Christians and I can live with that.
I could personally go to a church that worshipped on Sunday(or any other day) but I don't want to. It would cause problems for me at home and as I said I'm not smart enough to win a debate with my wife or any Adventist on that issue.
No my wife is not going to leave me over this she DOES love me part of her concern is as I said out of love she doesn't want me to be "lost".
I believe God is leading me in the direction he is leading me in He has found a way out of the Adventist Church for me that is also minimally disrupting my home. I believe in Christ as my salvation and the Gospel. WHY are you guys picking on me about me still choosing to worship on the Sabbath? I have NEVER said for one minute since I have been on this board that any of you are wrong for going to church on Sunday, it is your choice and the important thing is you believe in Christ. So WHY all this static towards me because I still want to go to church on the Sabbath. God saw how badly I was suffering in the Adventist Church and answered my prayers by showing me a way that I can live with and it seems I am being criticised for it.
Do you guys understand the upheaval in my family life that would ensue IF I went to a "Sunday" church.
I have enough things I'm struggling with right now, I don't need that.
At least I have found a church where I am free of the toxic SDA doctrines and can have peace at home while I am attending it.
And you gotta understand where my wife is coming from, the SDA church is all she has known all of her life. I love her very much and don't want to give her grief or pain and at least because I am still worshipping on the Sabbath as a Seventh Day Baptist it is causing a minimal amount of that.
Did you guys ever also think that maybe through my loving example of an improved Christian walk, this could eventually become a bridge for her out of the SDA church eventually?
Sorry if it seems like I'm venting but I feel like too much is being made of my continuing to want to go to church on the Sabbath. It IS ok to worship on the Sabbath, as much as it is to worship on Sunday or any other day.
(Message edited by Reb on May 31, 2007) |
River
Registered user
Username: River
Post Number: 806
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 11:50 am: | |
Melissa you said: The one point I do disagree with River on is that God will work all things out. The wife may leave if she is not committed to the marriage or in following God outside her box of 'right'. She's got freewill regardless of what God may want her to do. Scripture tells us in that case to let the unbelieving spouse leave and to live in peace.
Now notice this statement of quantification "Under Christ direct leadership it will fall into line providing you are not married to a rebellious woman who is rebellious to Christ and you and in that case good luck.
I don't think we disagree Melissa, I think I just said it in a diffrent way. Both have to be under Christ as the head of the church in order to expect these results. If one fails completely in this then the fabric is torn and that would work under the part of male or female.
I hope that that brings some clarity so no one reads me as saying that God will override an unbeliever with force.
If we are in disagreement I just can't figure out where it is or what we disagree on.
What I think is that we had a mistagreement not a disagreement. 
River |
Doug222
Registered user
Username: Doug222
Post Number: 559
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 11:59 am: | |
Reb,
As I indicated in my last post, I was simply asking for clarification. I don't think you will find a person here who doesn't believe that we have liberty as Christians to worship God on any day.
I totally understand your situation at home and agree that sometimes you have to look out for the greater good. It sounds like that is what you are doing. We have even had people who have stayed in the SDA Church for the sake of a spouse.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I the reason I was asking the questions is because you have made such a big deal out of the Sabbath and the 7th Day Baptist issue. I was simply seeking to understand.
At the risk of sounding like I am picking at the issue can I ask one more question for clarification purposes only? If the 10 commandments are binding on Christians, how does the church reconcile taking such a liberal view as it relates to the Sabbath issue (i.e. that it doesn't matter what day a person chooses)? Other churches seem to reconcile this issue by saying that the Sabbath command is the only commandment that was not repeated in the New Testament. Obviously, that is not the view of 7th Day Baptists. I have never met anyone who was a 7th Day Baptist, so I am just asking out of curiosity...in the same way that a person who has never met a SDA may be curious about their beliefs.
Doug |
Reb
Registered user
Username: Reb
Post Number: 113
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 12:12 pm: | |
Sorry, Doug. Ok I don't feel like I am being picked on anymore.
What I understnd of the Seventh Day Baptist belief on the Sabbath(and I am still new in that church and am learning) is that it IS one of the commandments and they keep it out of love for God.
My understanding is the Seventh Day Baptists believe it is more correct and Biblical to go to church on Saturday rather than Sunday, they just don't judge other Christians for going to church on Sunday and they do not consider such Christians "lost" Seventh Day Baptists do not consider the Sabbath to be the Seal of God like Adventists do and do not consider worshipping on Sunday to be the Mark of the Beast and they believe Christians who worship on Sunday are just as saved as any other as long as they believe in Christ and the Gospel.
It is just the conviction that the Sabbath is more correct as a day of worship based on their understanding of scripture, not someone's "visions' like the SDAs.
There are not the legalistic Sabbath rules like the SDAs have either, the Sabbath is basically a Church day as I understand it at this point.
Personally, I am probably more liberal than that, but again I am doing this for the "greater good" at home and can certainly live with this.
I would differ with offical SDB doctrine that the Sabbath is more correct but I prefer the Sabbath myself as the day of worship.
Hope this claifies the issue, Doug. I apologise if I seemed a bit testy.
God Bless.
(Message edited by Reb on May 31, 2007) |
Grace_alone
Registered user
Username: Grace_alone
Post Number: 557
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 12:29 pm: | |
Another jump-in, with all due respect...
From what I understand, the 10C's were never given to the Christians, so there has never been a "binding".
I do believe that any Christian should be allowed to worship on any day of the week, and encouraged to every day through prayer, song, kindness and love. Reb, I appreciate what you're trying to do with your wife. I can tell you that there's hope! My husband is what you would consider a Backslider SDA, and I thought he'd never come to church with me at my Lutheran church. We were together for 19 years before he started coming with me (since I take our kids each week) and he's been coming fairly regularly for 4 years now. He still won't become a member, but he told me that he doesn't believe that the SDA church is the "remnant" anymore. I was very glad to hear that from him just a couple of weeks ago!
Pray for your wife every time you think about it. God will bless you both! Also, be completely honest in your prayers and don't be afraid to pray for anything.
Leigh Anne |
Reb
Registered user
Username: Reb
Post Number: 115
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 12:33 pm: | |
Thanks, Leigh Anne.
I agree there IS hope. I'll just keep praying.
I also agree that any Christian should be allowed to worship God any or every day of the week. I still choose to worship on Sabbath for now but who knows where God will lead me in the future.
But I think I am right now where he wants me and at least I no longer have the toxic SDA doctrines. |
Godssonjp
Registered user
Username: Godssonjp
Post Number: 25
Registered: 1-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 1:19 pm: | |
Reb,
I apologize if it seemed as if I was picking on you. In no way was I trying to attack you for the day you choose to worship. My original concern was that you consider the seventh day of the week as "the Sabbath". I don't have a clear understanding of what SDB believe about the Sabbath, but according to the SDB official website, they don't, as you've stated, hold the Sabbath to be the "seal of God" or the final test as SDA do. But, they do hold the Sabbath in many other similar ways as the SDA.
Before I left the SDA church, actually years before I left, I stopped believing that the Sabbath was the seal of God and that "Sunday worship" was the mark of the beast. But I still believed that keeping Sabbath holy was what I HAD to do. At the time I figured that if I ever left the SDA church, I would still keep the Sabbath because I believed that that was what we ALL had to do. To show obedience to God. Because the Bible said so, to keep the commandments. I thought I HAD to keep the Sabbath in order to be saved. Once I got a better understanding of the Old and New Covenants I had to let go of the "Sabbath day" and hold on to "Sabbath rest". Keeping a day holy didn't make me holy or help to save me.
Whatever God has for you, is for you. He knows what to lead you through in order to bring you to Him. You and your wife. As you are on your journey into All Truth God will continue to reveal, in time, what he wants you to know and how to deal with it when you receive it. He's brought you this far. He won't let you down.
In loving kindness |
Reb
Registered user
Username: Reb
Post Number: 116
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 1:27 pm: | |
I agree. And I apologize if I seemed a bit harsh. I get it where you guys are coming from now. Maybe for me my journey has to be in baby steps. The SDB church IS an incremental improvement over the SDA church as at least they don't have EGW and do have the Gospel, even though they are Sabbatarians it's not quite the SDA brand of Sabbatarianism. It's an incremental improvement that means a lot to me.
It would be too traumatic for my wife for me to just jump right away to a "Sunday" church and she would not even see whether I have a better Christian walk or not. At least since I am still keeping the Sabbath at this point it isn't so much of a trauma that she won't look at how my walk with Christ is improving after shedding EGW.
Baby steps, in my case it HAS to be baby steps. |
Gcfrankie
Registered user
Username: Gcfrankie
Post Number: 2
Registered: 1-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 3:29 pm: | |
Reb,
I understand where you are coming from where the Sabbath is concerned. What scares me is the mentality of the Adventist religion about the Sabbath, that if you do not observe it the way they want you too you are put into the catagory as the unbelievers and harlots. The book of Hebrews says "Today, if anyone hears my voice" will be saved. I have not found it anywhere in the Bible that says,whoa you have to wait until the sabbath to be saved. Jesus preached everyday not just on the Jewish Sabbath and by His example He has left the door wide open to also rest and preach as long as we rest in Him, and give him the honor and the glory deserving of Him. Also along with this has to come the true teaching of the bible and Jesus. If you are looking for a good book to read concerning EGW's teachings I would suggest Walter Rea's book The White Lie. Hope this helps. |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 5952
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 4:51 pm: | |
Gcfrankie, welcome to the forum! (I haven't seen your first post yet, so my welcome is coming now!)
Reb, I understand what you are saying. I admit to having some of the same confusion or uncertainty expressed by the others here, and I particularly resonate (as a woman, no less!) with River's post about the husband having the spiritual leadership of the home. As I understand it, God will hold you accountable in a way different from your wife for the spiritual welfare of your family including your child.
I have realized that God asks us to be willing to surrender to Him absolutely everything we value: our homes, our cars, our children, even our marriages. If ANYTHING stands between us and obedience, and following Him, we have to give up our "right" to hold onto it and trust Jesus to take care of it for us. As long as we are trying to keep our spouses or parents or families happy as a primary objective, we put surrender on a back burner.
I see, Reb, that you are making strides. God is faithful. But as a woman I have to say, I would have trouble respecting a husband I could control by my anger or by threats. And yes, sometimes, as Melissa said, we do lose loved ones when we take our stand with the Lord Jesus.
He is faithful, however; you do not need to fear the future or the unknown. He will walk with you. Pray that you will know how to love your wife and your son for God--not for your sake or even for their sakes, but for God.
You can absolutely trust Him to walk with you and give you courage and wisdom and authority! God is leading you—and He is also asking you to take your appointed role as the spiritual leader and to make choices for the sake of Jesus, not for the sake of appeasing your wife's anger.
Colleen |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3721
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 31, 2007 - 5:16 pm: | |
Gcfrankie,
Welcome to FAF. Glad you are here. Tell us more about yourself and your journey with Jesus Christ, when you are ready.
Diana |
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