| Author | Message | ||
| Tkmommy Registered user Username: Tkmommy Post Number: 14 Registered: 1-2007 |
So saith my dear husband. We had an interesting discussion today, we had to travel to my MIL's today, a 1 1/2 hr drive, and our best discussions are while we are "captive" in the car. I was sharing the biblical evidence I had found reagarding Sabbath not being instituted until the Mosaic times, and he just couldn't see how one would NOT accept the Creation sabbath, as God rested on the seventh day. Now, this had always been my thinking untilI began to read biblical evidence otherwise. I shared other points, but he finished by just saying "God is a God of order!" Huh? His feeling was that God has always worked with order, numbers like 7, 40, etc, and he thinks the idea of setting one day out of seven for sabbath is in line with God's order. Changing that to Jesus being our sabbath rest 24/7 just throws chaos into it, and "God is a God of order!" Hmph. I had nothing to say....I didn't feel he had a biblical argument per say, more of a perception? We also touched on some other points, like the sanctuary, IJ, etc. I plan to study some on the sanctuary doctrine next to figure out what I truly believe about that. Anyway, hopefully we will have some more discussions in an open manner. What do you guys think of this God is a God of order comment? | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 371 Registered: 9-2006  |
To make the statement that God is a God of order may be falling a little bit short, an expert pool player might be able to put the balls in order on the pool table while being at the same time drunk. Does that mean at the same time that God is author of that order? Of course not, silly me. You might restate it to him that God is the author of ìDivine orderî and be more correct. The emphasis of course is the Sabbath, that being the point of discussion. (Mark 2:27 KJV) And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: Now the Adventist will quickly agree and all the while does ìserveî the ìDayî. What this does is reverse Gods divine order, his divine order was set forth in his Son Christ Jesus of which the Jewish Sabbath looked forward too. That haven of rest in our Lord and savior, ìEternal rest without endî although the Sabbath day does end now and yesterday. Has ended for all time for now our rest is in Christ Jesus. So is God a God of not just ìorderî but ì divine orderî? You tell me dear one. If you will study your Bible without compromise you will see his beautiful ìDivineî order. In Christ River | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 3306 Registered: 3-2004  |
I used to say that also. Now I see that human ideas are much different that divine ideas. Saying God is a God of order, human definition, is putting God in a small box. River, I really like your explanation. "Eternal rest without end" is that haven of rest in our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. Thank You. Tkmommy, Keep praying and studying and reading your Bible. God will tell you what to say and when to say it. He is so awesome. Diana | ||
| Raven Registered user Username: Raven Post Number: 700 Registered: 7-2004  |
Yes, God is a God of order. How else could there have been such incredibly specific instructions in how the earthly sanctuary should be constructed, all the do's and don't of the sacrifices, offerings, service, etc. Yet none of that is still in force. But God is a God of order, how could there possibly be so much free-form style in today's church buildings and services? Since God didn't instruct it a certain way for the NT era, then it must not have changed. Besides, God is the same yesterday, today, and forever. See my point? And yet we do have specific instruction in Hebrews that the old system is obsolete, the sacrifices are finished, and even in chapter 4 that God spoke somewhere concerning the 7th day, but now there is another day, Today. | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 373 Registered: 9-2006 |
The reason for the vast differences in the buildings of today, not built after the old pattern is because Jesus is our sanctuary; the old pattern looked forward to a pattern not made with manís hands. He dwells in us if so we have been born again, does the Holy Spirit need a Sabbath day? Or a certain kind of building? He is Lord of the Sabbath being the third person of the trinity. If so he dwells within you he is ever present within you, what would he have need to drag you around in preparation for a certain day for? He is in you and you are in him if so he dwells within you, 24/7/365 so answer me this, what day or hour is he not with you, you donít have to wait until Saturday to commune with him or meet with him or honor him, you can do that right where you stand if so he dwells within you. Yeh, even when you get up and your hair is sticking straight up and you look in the mirror and go îAhhhhaaaaa!!î and you are so ugly your dog wonít let you feed him. River | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 5259 Registered: 12-2003  |
Great points, River, Diana, and Raven, about God being a God of "divine order". If you step back from the Bible and look at the nation of Israel and the Mosaic law as a giant living metaphor of a Truth that is much bigger than time and physical reality, the divine "order" begins to make sense. All of the shadows of the OT, including the Sabbath, pointed toward Jesus. As River points out, even His presence in the temple foreshadowed His presence in us, His living templeóHis body. In literature we understand figurative language. We have no trouble identifying foreshadowing and metaphors as glimpses of the story's climax or the main moral points. The Bible is just like any other book. It is full of metaphors, foreshadowing, and symbolism, and it all points forward to Jesus and to the fulfillment of God's purposes through Him. In Adventism we thought of the OT metaphors as "reality", and we couldn't get our minds around the idea that any of that would "change", because "God never changes". But whe we can look at the entire experience of Israel as a giant living metaphor bringing people to a recognition of man's sinfulness via the work of the law (see Romans 5), teaching them to trust God, foreshadowing His rest by Sabbath observance and feast days, etc., we can see that God IS a God of orderóit's just that His order is much bigger than physical reality. Physical reality is a servant of eternal reality; hence Sabbath was a foreshadowing of living every day in trust in God. The New Testament explains the mysteries of Christ and the Church. These things were completely hidden from Israelóbut they were foreshadowed in the prophecies and in the ceremonies they had to perform. Jesus is the substance of all the OT shadows. Colleen | ||
| Raven Registered user Username: Raven Post Number: 701 Registered: 7-2004 |
Very well said, Colleen! |
