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Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 5257
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2007 - 7:08 pm: |     |
The idolatry of Sabbath within Adventism is actually sort-of shocking to me as I look backward. The sense of the holiness and specialness and "blessing" of the day dominated my spiritual life. I remember, as a young-un, reading in Ellen that the whole week should be organized and planned to make Sabbath the goal and focus and fulfillment of the entire seven days. As the week went on, we were preparing for Sabbath.
Without doubt Adventists treat the Sabbath (even if they don't label it thus) as a god. They honor, sacrifice, risk, and reverence the day as Christians do for Jesus. Because of this idolatry, Adventists who move into a relationship with Jesus will ultimately have trouble experiencing their full assurance in Jesus alone if they also try to observe the day as a preference or habit.
For an Adventist, Sabbath has a spiritual significance that, I believe, is different than it is for other Sabbatarians. It has its own holiness and blessing. For an Adventist, the Sabbath is a means of grace.
But we have to know and act on the fact that Jesus is enough. He alone is all we need. Thank God for Jesus, for the Living Word! Thank God He knew us and called us to Himself.
Colleen |
Randyg
Registered user
Username: Randyg
Post Number: 350
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2007 - 8:17 pm: | |
I am enjoying this discussion.
As some of you know us Canadians enjoy our Hockey. It is sort of a second religion up here.
Growing up many Sabbath discussions, and clock watchings have pertained to when we could turn the TV on to watch the game. During the mid of winter it was never really a concern as sundown had usually occurred by the time the game started on Saturday night. As spring would come with its longer days, and the playoffs arrived the anticipation, and cheating the minutes of the sabbath inadvertently seemed to occur.
Three years ago in Kelowna, we had the Canadian Major Junior Championships---the Memorial Cup occured in our lovely city in May of 2003. Now there are many Adventists friends who are season's ticket holders and serious fans, and the Saturday night game created quite a dilemma for many.
Most during the regular season give there friday night tickets away....but this was the National Championship Game, and it started an hour before sundown.
This was dealt with in a number of ways.
We went to the game and anticipated our angels would enjoy the whole thing.
My Adventist buddy who has seats in front of me brought his family into town and stayed at the Grand Hotel across the street from the arena for the weekend, He was there for the opening faceoff, but his wife and the kids played in the pool at the hotel until sundown, and then they came in and joined us for the last two periods.
A few of the other Adventists listened to the game in there car in the parking lot until sundown, then came in.
And the diehards walked along the lake on the boardwalk across the street from the arena until sundown and then came in.
I have to smile to myself as I think back to that night and watching everybody deal with their conscience in there own way.
As my understanding has evolved, it seems that the pettiness, and the legalism of the whole situation must have had God looking down and just shaking his head. I can only imagine what He thinks as his children try and maintain their salvation by "Keeping the Sabbath".
I suspect He figures that maybe it will dawn on them at sometime, how foolish we can be sometimes as we try and keep up appearances for the sake of what others might think. And pay lip service to what is really our Salvation and freedom----our relationship with Christ.
Go Rockets Go,
Randy |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3305
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2007 - 8:39 pm: | |
Randy,
If I do not laugh at what you wrote, I would cry. It is still so sad that a person does not enjoy a relationship with Jesus Christ and in doing that enjoys life so much better.
I went dancing on Friday nights, after my divorce, and as I look back, I do not remember feeling guilty, outwardly. I was SDA at the time. I did try to get up Saturday morning and go to church and then I would go dancing that night again. I went to church to balance the life, part for myself and part for Jesus. I am so thankful, I do not have to do that. I quit trying to balance my life, because I figured since I was divorced and was doing everything I had learned was wrong, I should just enjoy it and have fun. After all when Jesus came and I was destroyed, I would be gone and not suffer. Through it all, God was teaching me and caring for me. He gave me a good sense of rhythm and I am a good dancer, be it line dancing, country western, big band, latin!!! Big band and latin dancing are my favorites.
I can imagine God's thoughts as He looked down at me in all I did. His hand was definitely in my raising my son.
So, I am very thankful, I do not have to worry any more as I serve God 24/7. I do not save it for one day any more.
Our 24/7 is a relationship with Jesus Christ and I do not worry about legalism. I do pray for our SDA brothers and sisters that they can be free in Christ also.
Our God is awesome.
Diana |
Bmorgan
Registered user
Username: Bmorgan
Post Number: 111
Registered: 7-2000
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 4:53 am: | |
Do you remember the counsel from EGW, "Guard the edges of the Sabbath-put our of sight secular books and magazines, sabbath baths taken before and "end" your holy ones a while after the designated time?" ....we should've been getting it right, you'd think.
Boy did I jump through hoops. Like your mother, Raven, we tried to be consistent, not rabid. We loved "keeping" sabbath holy", no cheating .....I remember how we'd patiently wait after sundown, just to be sure. Physically and mentally I did not try to get around Sabbath
Our family "enjoyed" and always had people, both friends and strangers, over at our home to share sabbath meals with us. We found it was a goood time for reading or listening to Bible Stories (Your Story Hour and Bible in Living sound-all SDA). We read lots of missionaries stories or watched nature videos.
I became a passionate Bird Watcher and nature lover We walked hike and bike trails, visited the nature centers and/or state parks, with a purpose. We identified trees, plants and birds. Remember the Pathfinder/Master Guide honors? We incorporated many activities and requirements for them, on our own, during sabbath hours.
We conditioned our children and had simple, fun rituals so we'd love Sabbath more. We made it "special". I concorted a special breakfast dish and menu for us to eat on the occasion- Sabbath. The children had treats-healthy junk food- sugarless candy, chewing gum, fruit leather, exotic dried fruit, etc., stored in can in our kitchen which they had the "freedom" to eat, only on Sabbaths.
At church the opening prayers sounding something like "Dear Lord, we thank you for the Sabbath day, bless the sabbath day, etc."
Though I loved, served and obeyed "Sabbath"; put nothing before it; though I did not cheat nor lied but was faithful to it; though I tried to neither judge, condemn or compare myself with other people on the matter of Sabbath keeping; I still kept coming up short. Like a dog chasing its tail, it was an exercise in futility chasing the shadow.
As a person, a former Sabbathkeeping Adventist, who faithfully and dutifully observed sabbath, I have to renounce it totally. I serve a Risen Savior whose in the world today, He lives in my heart. For me to pay homage to sabbath, would really be attaching myself to an idol and a spirit of deception.
..nuff said.
Erma bmorgan Toussaint
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River
Registered user
Username: River
Post Number: 370
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 7:43 am: | |
Concerning the Sabbath keeping and as Randy was talking about in trying to juggle times for the games.
The thing that strikes me most about what you all discuss concerning your experience as Adventist Sabbath keeping is so much of time is taken up by observation, preparations, and actual effort put forth at keeping the day.
So much time, effort, thought, teaching dedicated to ěThe dayî so that it appears to me that ěThe dayî although so much emphasisís placed upon its observance, instead of becoming a delight, becomes a yoke, just as in the day when Jesus walked the earth and the Pharisees followed him continually picking nits and bringing question and accusation too Jesus.
They tried to impose the very yoke they themselves struggled under upon the very Son of God. In effect what they were saying is that we will receive your miracles if you will bow down to our teachings. IMO.
The result of it actually taking away the Glory that is due our Lord by serving a day and time of his creation, the rising and setting of the sun and taking away the time and effort in seeking the Lord Jesus which is due the risen Son. (Acts 17:27 KJV) That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
Now if that isnít enough, bent upon preying upon non-suspecting Christians in order to drag them down too that level. Distributing colorful books, pamphlets that is filled with eye candy too adults and children alike and if possible, pull them under the very yoke they wear with pride and haughty exclusion of all Christendom, labeling them apostate, Babylon, slated to receive the mark of the beast, even those that give of themselves to the point that they pour out their whole lives in order to preach the gospel and attend the needs of Godís precious sheep.
Just as EGW and her followers brazenly shut the door, refusing to pray for the lost, the Adventist do not pray for them but upon them. IMO.
Like an inch worm who inches slowly but surely to his death, they inch slowly forward an inch at a time to capture unsuspecting Christians and sinners alike and thus dragging them into their own web of deceit.
I suspect that nowhere is there a scripture more apt than this one, (2 Pet 2:19 KJV) While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
Where is the promised liberty in their midst, I see no more that a pall of death hanging over them like a blanket, a thick smoke swallowing up and choking all who would venture there.
Saints, do I sound hard so that it sets your teeth on edge? Remember Stephen? Do you think that I would draw his sentence if I preached to the Adventist church?
Well maybe not, but I daresay I would be rode out of there on a rail to say the least, perhaps receiving a few good licks in the process if they thought the sheriff was out on vacation.
Now my view is from the outside in and in some ways that may be an advantage and in some ways not.
One time the old grandfather was asleep on his chair and his Grand Son decided to smear limburger cheese in his mustache, the grandfather wakes up and declares ěThis room stinks!î walks in the kitchen and declares ěThe kitchen stinks!î walks out on the back porch and declares ěThe whole world stinks!!!î when if fact it was his own mustache that stank.
That just may describe me my friends. I struggle to bring truth and clarity and at the same time try to avoid bringing railing accusation to no one and it becomes an emotional juggling act too which only the balm and comforting and piece of the Holy Spirit can and does bring relief and rest.
Paul didnít call it spiritual warfare in vain my friends.
River
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Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 3307
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 10:14 am: | |
River,
I do agree. It is spiritual warfare. The good thing about it is that Jesus is victorious, at the cross, and Satan does not have a chance. There is no great controversy between Christ and Satan.
I am glad you are here to learn about the SDA mindset. You understand it very well.
Keeping the sabbath, took our thoughts away from Jesus and on how can I keep the sabbath so I do not displease God.
I am so thankful, I am no longer there. God is so awesome as he gently tugged me out of adventism.
Diana
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Javagirl
Registered user
Username: Javagirl
Post Number: 348
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 1:22 pm: | |
Diana, the pastor today at chuch preached a sermon on Genesis 1:1. Well actually, he only got to the first part.
In the beginning God....
That was the whole sermon, those four words.
It was a perfect sermon to add to you point "There is no great controversy between Christ and Satan"
He stated, "it was not God and Satan in the beginning, it was not even God and Evil. It was 'In the beginning GOD.'"
GOD ALONE
The Sovereign GOD.
His whole illustration was based on his son's hotwheels!
We do not hold up our hotwheels and ask GOD to climb into our little cars with us, and travel along our journey.
We grab our hotwheels and all our possessions in our hands, and ask THE UNCREATED GOD if we can climb on his GREYHOUND BUS. His bus. His journey.
He doesnt NEED us to prove anything for Him to the universe or anything else. But he will allow us to climb aboard His bus, and not only that, He delights in our company!
Yeah, He is awesome Diana
Now back to the discussion, I was momentarily nervous on the way to church, when the gas light came on. I was afraid I wouldnt make it back home. Then I "remembered" that is was okay to fill up with gas on the way to church, I wouldn't be "breaking" a sabbath day... SIGH. Old habits are hard to break!
Lori |
River
Registered user
Username: River
Post Number: 372
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 3:06 pm: | |
Lori,
When I was an alcoholic I drove with a large percent of my attention on the rear view mirror looking for state police and city police cars, that was 35 years ago, to this day a car can hardly ever be behind me that I am not aware of it and I will spot a police car miles in my rear view even today.
I think some old habits probably stay with us for good.
I have no reason to feel a tinge of guilt every time I see a police car but true to what you said, "Old habits are hard to break. Sighing with you.
River |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 5262
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, January 14, 2007 - 11:34 pm: | |
Erma and Lori, I totally resonate with your posts. The careful preparation, the attempts to make the day " a delight" without understanding the complete rest of Jesus, the pangs of guilt about the occasional empty gas tanks and secular conversation not to mention mere thoughts, the singing of "Day Is Dying In the West" at sundown on Sabbath (and/or on Friday night)ótruly Sabbath was the focus of life.
I truly had to totally turn from any form of Sabbath observance or honor. It held the place of an idol in my life and also in my theology. It was MORE than merely a practice; it was the proof of my being "in the truth", of my commitment to God. It was a practice that I had to renounce the same way Paul called the Galatians to renounce circumcision and their subsequent return to observing days, seasons, etc.
Colleen |
Susans
Registered user
Username: Susans
Post Number: 381
Registered: 8-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 8:33 am: | |
"It was MORE than merely a practice; it was the proof of my being "in the truth", of my commitment to God. It was a practice that I had to renounce the same way Paul called the Galatians to renounce circumcision and their subsequent return to observing days, seasons, etc. "
Amen to this, Colleen! I totally agree that it was my experience as well, and what I saw in my Adventists friends, too. Everything revolved around Sabbath, and the preparation for it. Now everything revolves around Jesus!
Susan |
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