| Author |
Message |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 818
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 8:19 pm: |     |
I feel driven to respond to something that has been said over at R/S, and since this thread addresses them, it is as good a place to do so as any. SDAZeal has been rude to Christian in every way possible. Having lived on Zeal's side of the fence at one time I know that he/she has been programmed to respond to discussions about diet and the Sabbath in a specific manner. The lead-ins and logic are pure Adventist. Because the Sabbath is mentioned in the story of the Creation, it is a forever institution. Adventists never even consider the fact that Sabbath isn't mentioned again until after the Egyptian exodus. Hey fellas, Moses wrote the Pentateuch. The reference to Sabbath in the creation story could very likely have been a rhetorical comment leading the Isrealites to the reason why God was calling upon them to revere the seventh day. Also, Christian is correct in saying that the OT should be considered through the lens of the NT. Paul may have only had the OT when he was writing his epistles, but other references to Paul's letters made by Peter and the apostles make it clear that they knew that those same letters were as important as the biblical texts from the old testament. Paul's old testament also contained the books called the apochrapha.
Christian, I appreciate your efforts to communicate the Gospel and its simplicity to the people there at R/S, but having stated and restated the same things you are telling them now, there are a number of us here who will tell you that you are speaking to a group of people who have been programmed, just like the people in airports with the daisies and the orange robes have been programmed. It doesn't seem odd to them that they are picking and choosing amongst the Judaic laws. The food restrictions are at the very center of what Adventists call The Levitical Law, but since Sister White endorsed the kosher diet (actually she endorsed an even stricter diet -- the diet of Daniel and the three worthies), they will follow that diet. Why? Because she said so. Really, there is no other reason. All of those references to the kosher laws aside, there really isn't a good reason to eat the Adventist way other than the fact that Sister White said to. Most of them don't know enough about Sister White to even know what you are talking about when you tell them that she ate oysters. It is a matter of historic record that she ate canned oysters, but that is kept hushed up by the higher-ups in the Adventist organization. Sadly, most Adventists will try to refute the oyster information because that would put a chink in their prophet's armor. In the past 25 or more years they have overlooked her tendency to plagerize, her dietary indiscretions, and her inconsistencies. If they were to take an honest look at all of that they would have to give up their "specialness," and they would find out that they are just another Christian sect. And one that needs to come up to speed on the basics of the Gospel at that.
I have many friends who are members of the Adventist Church, and I love every one of them. I also know that I have to be careful what I say about Ellen White when I'm around them or they will drop me like a hot potato. Never mind that we have been a part of each other's lives for 50+ years in some cases. They can say anything they want, and often do, around me and I will love them still. I also know that they are a little fearful that I will become their enemy during the Time of Trouble (another unique Adventist reference to the final days before Jesus returns) I also know that some of my friends truly love Jesus Christ, and for the right reasons, but they are afraid to make that one last step of complete surrender to Jesus for their salvation because they were raised to believe that they had a behavioral obligation to fulfill before Jesus can save them. I love these people and they know it and I would never hurt them, but because I no longer walk the same line they do they fear that I am putty in Satan's hand.
What would make a group of religious people attack others who profess to love the same God they profess to love? Why is it so important to them that they be considered to be so special? Why are they so willing to write everyone else off as lost based on a day and diet? You can trace all of this craziness back to their need to have a special prophet in their midst. |
Windmotion
Registered user
Username: Windmotion
Post Number: 241
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 11:42 pm: | |
Has anyone ever though the "stars in the crown" as EGW presents it is just a big pyramid scheme? At the end the people at the bottom are going to get burned. Umm I didn't mean that literally. 
Analytically,
Hannah |
Anotherseeker
Registered user
Username: Anotherseeker
Post Number: 23
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 8:32 am: | |
BELVALEW!!
Today you first brought a lump to my throat and then a smile to my face!
THE LUMP: "Jesus did it all, all to him i owe"
I had forgotten about that BEAUTIFUL Hymn.
THEN............ your SLIPPERY HEAD HAHAHA!! |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 821
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:37 pm: | |
Hannah, you really are very special indeed. I'd never really looked at the "stars" issue before, but it really is a Ponzi scheme the way Ellen White describes it. I have, in fact, worried about that poor soul who was the last one to get the word before Jesus comes again. That sucker is out of luck because he/she won't have time to pass the word along.
I praise God again and again that my salvation is not hinged on anything that I can do and is instead firmly grounded in the might and power of the blood of Jesus Christ. I'd like to think that I would walk through fire for Him, but He may not need me to do that. Again and again I have to remind myself that I'm not even a part of the "doing" equation. I'm merely a branch on the vine. The vine dresser has to lift me up out of the mud, give me something to lean on, prune away the suckers and unnecessary parts, then any fruit my branch produces is based on the power of the vine flowing through me and the blessed light I am allowed to bask in. |
Windmotion
Registered user
Username: Windmotion
Post Number: 244
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 5:34 pm: | |
I'm special, huh. Hmmm I don't know what to say.
Uniquely,
Hannah |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 826
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 2:28 pm: | |
I've been reading R/S every day and have found that Guibox, Mr. Box, is a proponent of the true gospel and is probably having his fellow SDA's chide him about believing in cheap grace. He responded to sdazeal in this manner just a little while ago:
----------
Well, then go ahead and spiritually flagellate yourself to make you perfect in God's eyes. I will serve God because I love Him and let His blood take care of my sins.
Have fun futiley working your way to heaven!
Remember that when you realize that you are sinful and your 'perfection by works' can't save you, Christ is there to apply His robe of righteousness to you.
How freeing from the burden of guilt and efforts is the true gospel. I just wish more SDAs felt it instead of loading themselves down with the anti-Christ doctrine you spout here.
Perhaps if we preached the true gospel, we wouldn't have so many leaving and becoming bitter critics of our church.
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Mr. Box, I agree with you with a whole heart. I really wanted to believe that the church of my birth, the church of my childhood and education, had their finger on the pulse of the true gospel. It was a period of grieving for me when I faced the fact that they did not. There are tons of good, loving, believers within the Adventist church, but they are all laboring under the idea that there is a human component to salvation. It cheers me to see that you are aware that there is not. How liberating it is to know that you don't have to complete a perfect salvation with our own humanly imperfect efforts. I'm praying for you as you keep pressing that information home. It is too bad that most SDA's have been taught not to trust the words of Paul, and they are particularly leary of Romans, Galations, and Hebrews. Good luck. |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 2134
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 4:19 pm: | |
There are at least two who have taken up the banner for Jesus, Guibox and Christian. I hope and pray that they do not get kicked off, but I do know if they become part of the banned, Jesus will have some one else on there.
Diana |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 827
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, December 23, 2005 - 7:10 pm: | |
I fear Christian's voice has been silenced by the dreaded ban. He was carrying on valiantly, then silence, and sdazeal seemed to be gloating about him being banned. I pray I am wrong, so I keep looking for his name again. He made the same mistake we all made--he made it clear that he didn't think much of Ellen White. For site membership, that is a fatal mistake. |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 2138
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 11:10 am: | |
Belva,
I was sick this past week when I posted on here, so I did not notice your comment about your slippery hair. I just noticed it and laughed.
We all know that God will send others to the R/S site to speak up for Him. Another one not posting on there is Bill, remember Him?? I can only guess he got banned also.
Diana |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 828
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 24, 2005 - 1:20 pm: | |
I saw a one-line post from Christian posted just this morning, so he is soldiering on. I do pray for him as he confronts those harpies. They think nothing of attacking their own and are downright viscious with anyone who disagrees with them. |
Schasc
Registered user
Username: Schasc
Post Number: 46
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 8:32 pm: | |
Belvalew,
You mentioned in a earlier post about EGW eating oysters..........where can I find that?
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction
schasc |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 834
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 11:07 pm: | |
I believe the oyster reference can be found in Walter Rae's book The White Lie. I have none of my exposee books with me because I loaned them to my cousin over a year ago, so it is hard for me to confirm. If you look on this site www.revivalsermons.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=825 I am certain you will be able to track down the reference. I do not begrudge her her craving for oysters, what I hold against her is that she would not make allowances for anyone else having those same cravings. I no longer believe that anything any of us do or don't do will have any effect on our salvation, but when you are in a position of influence such as she was, and you personally are responsible for telling others that they must adhere to a particular diet, or mode of behavior and make it a salvation issue, you had better toe the same line you have drawn in the sand for everyone else. |
Goldenbear
Registered user
Username: Goldenbear
Post Number: 129
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 28, 2005 - 11:34 am: | |
Schasc,
Was over in your neck of the woods at Christmas. Didn't have time to connect. I believe what you are looking for is found at:
http://ellenwhite.org/contra6.htm
goldenbear |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 837
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 28, 2005 - 1:36 pm: | |
Schasc, I just noticed that I steered you wrong on the information about oysters. Thank you, Goldenbear, for making up for my mistake.
Belva
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