| Author | Message | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 8167 Registered: 9-2006  |
I heard a preacher the other day who said that legalism was a greater sin than all the other sins of the flesh. Having been acquainted with several Adventists personally, I have really never met a people who lead cleaner lives, they don’t drink alcohol, they don’t do drugs, they don’t smoke cigarettes, or use bad language. Who they remind me of is the Amish. So what the preacher said stuck in my mind. I look at the way Adventist live from birth, and I admire it. You would have to come from my back ground to understand that. I was an alcoholic, and it is only by the grace of God that I didn’t spend my life in some prison. I was everything you wouldn’t want to be. So is legalism more dangerous to the soul than all the things I was? Perhaps, because it makes you dependant on the particular brand of legalism you are stuck in, although I can’t say I realized the condition I was in, and asked God to save me. He literally reached down and hauled me out before I could ask him to save me. Oh sure, I prayed the sinners prayer, but it was after God freed me enough to pray the sinners prayer. If you read my book, ‘God Are You Up There?’ you know part of my story. I wrote it based on my true story as outlandish as it reads. A legalistic person who from birth led a clean life going to church would never have to say they were a drunk, a druggie, and practiced all the other sins of the flesh at one time or another, and I’m thankful they don’t, and yet God showers his grace freely, and to try to climb into heaven any other way is for a person to become a usurper of that free gift he is so willing to shower upon us… even me. As the fellow said, “Its Jesus plus nothing.” Legalism always tries to add something, and makes foolish Galatians of us doesn’t it? Legalism says, “Oh, you’ll be ok, don’t you attend Sabbath? Stay away from pork, cigarettes, liquor and fast women? Heart be quiet, somehow you’ll make it, just try a little harder.” In the end the person slides into hell on the skids of works, because the only way is through the shed blood of Jesus, his full and complete atonement. | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1580 Registered: 2-2011  |
River~ I have witnessed too many times, the "legalism" of adventists, of which you speak, very often is what carries them off into excessive alcohol use and "drugs", either "Prescribed" or not, it doesn't matter. The excuse for the addictions is that it is the only thing that gives relief from the "legalism" of All the other "rules'! This alcohol/drug use is done in 'secret'~ not enough so that they are 'falling down drunk or over medicated', but none-the-less they are 'addicted'. How tragic is that? ~mj~ | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 8168 Registered: 9-2006 |
I am very surprised to hear you say that...well...shocked might be a better word. I guess what you are looking at is not always what it appears. River | ||
| Islander Registered user Username: Islander Post Number: 42 Registered: 4-2014 |
Here's my two cents worth on legalism being a heavy duty sin. Legalism = unhumbleness ( is that even a real word? Colleen, you're the English professor here,is the word "unhumbleness" accepted?). Jesus spent a lot of time and effort stressing the need to be humble because as we have learned we are saved by grace, not our own works so none of us can boast. Besides, unhumble people make everyone else around them miserable . | ||
| Islander Registered user Username: Islander Post Number: 43 Registered: 4-2014 |
Another quick story about this topic. Two old men are on a bench argueing. While easedropping what's the giveaway that they are Lutheran? The answer: they are argueing over which of them is the most humble. I heard that one at church, it's Lutheran humor but I think on this forum we'll all get it. | ||
| Resjudicata Registered user Username: Resjudicata Post Number: 315 Registered: 4-2014 |
"unhumbleness" = "Pride" | ||
| Mjcmcook Registered user Username: Mjcmcook Post Number: 1581 Registered: 2-2011 |
River~ Again, sorry to say, what I wrote in my post #1580 is True~ It is also interesting to note, that often adventists who are present at friends and family members homes( who are also adventists) for visits often do what is called a "fade" before leaving for the visit! It is not important how any of the people relate to the religion...they do the "Fade" as a 'self-defense' mechanism. "Fade"~ alcohol or meds to "take the edge off" so they can endure the upcoming association~ Often these people sometimes carry extra alcohol in their own small personal container to tide them over till they leave...same with the "meds"~ I agree with what you said, "I guess what you are looking at is not always what it appears." ~mj~ | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 14938 Registered: 12-2003  |
It's true. The Adventists who want to be Adventists but can't actually be good enough are often closet addicts and abusers. Well, abuse it pretty much rampant throughout the religion, from the conservative, historic Adventists to the liberal ones because they have no ground of truth to stand on.They have to self-medicate or otherwise distract themselves to survive. Colleen | ||
| Islander Registered user Username: Islander Post Number: 45 Registered: 4-2014 |
The central fresno, California sda church had a clinical social worker who attended there. I am talking a good 25 years ago. She met with members in a church office privately to offer counseling and such. She apatently has since psssed away but I remember her saying too many of the people in that cingreation were dependent on mood alterating meds. | ||
| Paxel Registered user Username: Paxel Post Number: 26 Registered: 8-2011  |
Made me think of this “Therefore, continued Evangelist, Mr. Worldly Wiseman is an alien, and Mr. Legality is a cheat. . . Believe me, there’s nothing in all this noise you’ve heard from this foolish man except a plan to cheat you of your salvation by turning you away from the Path in which I set you.” -Chapter 3, The Pilgrim’s Progress in Modern English | ||
| Asurprise Registered user Username: Asurprise Post Number: 3472 Registered: 7-2007 |
River; that preacher is right! A legalistic person will never accept Jesus' finished work because to him, it requires faith plus works to be saved. So there's no way he can be saved! |
