| Author | Message | ||
| Martinc Registered user Username: Martinc Post Number: 200 Registered: 9-2006 |
Have you ever had an encounter with someone, let’s say a respectable person in Christian circles, who acted “nice” to you in a way that felt very wrong? Though nothing was done that broke any rules, did that someone’s manner somehow give away a malevolent darkness, and it gave you the chills? This happened to me recently, and it prompted me to explore this with you all. Is kindness, as a fruit of the Spirit, the same as what most people consider kindness? Victor Frankl said there are only two kinds of people in the world, the “decent,” and the “indecent.” Secular kindness is what people, who want to be “decent,” try to practice. It is a compliment to be called a kind person, and most people can be considerate to each other at least some of the time. On the other hand, Paul said that there is no one who does good (“kindness” Gr. chrestotes), not even one. We are not capable of genuine goodness. The corrupt person can certainly do nice things, as Jesus said, “And if you do good to those who do good to you, what benefit is that to you? For even sinners do the same.” So my sense of that meeting with the respected church member was that this is someone who Frankl would call “decent,” or “nice,” but who is not displaying the fruit of the Spirit (There are other, confidential reasons why I have concluded this. It is also possible I am wrong and am being judgmental). So secular kindness is actually being merely “nice,” while Spirit-gifted kindness is goodness at a higher level. When we are born again, the Spirit gifts us with a kindness that would rather be hurt than to hurt others (Bartlett). This was impossible before we came alive in Christ. Here’s an effort to compare and contrast them: Niceness is pleasant, pretty and well-behaved, but only external. Kindness is genuine and from the heart. Niceness, to be more effective, needs better social skills. Kindness requires minimal social skills. Niceness can be delivered with a skillful hand and a wicked heart. Kindness delivers grace with no hidden hazards. Niceness hopes for gratitude. Kindness springs from the gratitude of a rescued heart. Niceness keeps its self-protecting dignity. Kindness is a down-on-the-knees, foot-washing kind of service for the unclean. Niceness requires little to no sacrifice. Kindness will go to extremes, even to lay down one’s life. I welcome your thoughts! Martin C | ||
| Dljc Registered user Username: Dljc Post Number: 184 Registered: 7-2010 |
Martin, I gave the following Sermon once, and as I studied for it and looked at myself as a sinner, it was very humbling. As I thought about all the things I've done it made me realize there is nothing I could do that would save me from myself. "Self" is our problem, and what you are pointing to is just that "Self motivated niceness". Here's the Sermon: Galatians 5:16-26 The Spirit vs. the flesh. Read verses from Galatians 5: I know many of you have read this passage and maybe even done a study on it. But the Lord led me here in relation to the previous message on “The Truth vs. bondage” as a follow-up to it. In the first list we see the things of the flesh, and in the second we see the fruit of the Spirit. Lets separate the two lists first. Verses: 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: In verse 19 we see it starts out with sexual sins not limited to just adultery and fornication, but all sexual immorality. Romans 1:26,27 are included in this because in Rome at the time homosexuality was evident. Paul spoke on the sins he saw in the different places. Romans 1:26,27 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. Romans 1:29-31 29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Now that we have the works of the flesh more obvious to us, lets look at the fruit of the Spirit. Galatians 5:22,23 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. How many of the fruit of the Spirit do you see in that list? There is not one of them is there? In both passages from Galatians and Romans we can see the works of the flesh and not once is love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, and temperance mentioned is there? The flesh cannot possess any of the true qualities of the fruit of the Spirit without God, because the fruit of the Spirit comes from Him. Just as the manifestations of the flesh are apparent to others, so are the fruit of the Spirit. I can stand here and tell you I have love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, and temperance, but if you don’t see that in me, then who’s kidding who? We have been taught a worldly understanding of the different qualities mentioned in the fruit of the Spirit. I want you to think about what happened in the Garden of Eden. Man fell and Adam and Eve were kicked out of the Garden. We live in a fallen world, and our understanding of things has become corrupted over the thousands of years man has been outside of the Garden. God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son to save us. (John 3:16) Man had become corrupted to the point of God wiping out every living thing on the entire planet except 8 people, in just a few thousand years, before God told Noah to build the Ark. We can look back through the Old Testament and see that that corruption still exists, and that’s why Jesus had to come. If you look at some of these accounts in the Old Testament you can see that man (this body) has no love, no joy, no peace, no patience, no gentleness, no goodness, no faith, no meekness, and no temperance (or self-control). That is, without God in our life we can only have the worldly understanding of these qualities of the fruit of the Spirit. But they are fleeting at best, because we put hope in the wrong things. How many times have we put our faith in another person only to be let down? How many times did we have no peace in a situation that was in chaos? How many times have we loved someone the way the world understands love, only to be let down? How many times has our patience been pushed to the limit? And that could be as simple as the coffee was to hot or cold. How many times did we take advantage of someone who was meek or gentle? How many times have we given in to the lust of the flesh? How many times have we rebelled against God because our flesh is at enmity with Him? Every time we ventured out onto those limbs right? You see, the flesh doesn’t have any of the qualities of the fruit of the Spirit unless we are walking in the Spirit. That’s what Galatians 5:16-26 is talking about. We only have the worldly understanding of these qualities that can be and often are, fleeting because we put our faith in the wrong things “man”, but more to the point “self”. God will never leave us nor forsake us, He keeps His promises even though we don’t. Now look a little further into Galatians 6:7,8 7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. God knows whether these qualities of the fruit of the Spirit are truly in us. We can’t fool Him can we? If we sow from the flesh we will reap corruption, but if we sow from the Spirit it will be fruitful. Nothing comes back void; everything is either fruitful or corrupt. Recognizing the difference between the two is the first step. Man (or self) will let us down every time. Jesus won’t. Jesus said in John 14:6 I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one comes to the Father but by me. He told us in Matthew 7:13,14 to enter in at the strait gate; for broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:. Look at these two lists from Romans and Galatians and see how broad a path it really is. As oppose to the narrow way Jesus has made. 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. We have a choice of which path we will take in every situation. We will reap what we sow. Even the world recognizes the Golden Rule, “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you”. Jesus said these same words in Matthew 7:12 “Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. ” Psalm 118:8 It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man. He will never leave you nor forsake you. | ||
| Martinc Registered user Username: Martinc Post Number: 201 Registered: 9-2006 |
Breaking the Code of Niceness This "niceness" problem really affects us formers. Kindness from the Spirit isn't always pleasant or skillfully delivered, and this gets former SDA's into serious trouble when we violate certain social rules. Here's a good example. In liberal Loma Linda, there is what I'll call a "Code of Niceness," which demands that we former Adventists are not to say anything critical about Adventism or its doctrines. It isn't nice or tolerant to criticize any religious group's teachings, activities, or history. When we do, it can be considered "hate speech." For this reason, our Friday night study at Trinity has a reputation for spreading hatred for Adventists as people. Some of our members in the study get pretty passionate in expressing their feelings about the oppressions they lived through in Adventism, and visitors (maybe even regular attendees) have been offended. Since our feelings of outrage aren't kept to ourselves, we can appear crass and rude. Sometimes we are, but so are the victims of any abusive system who gather and tell their stories. Our FAF group is like an urgent care clinic at times, the work isn't always pretty, but it needs to be done...kind of like foot washing. Martin C | ||
| Martinc Registered user Username: Martinc Post Number: 202 Registered: 9-2006 |
Hi Dljc, thanks for posting your sermon, it clearly shows from scripture how our natural ways are not the ways of the Spirit. It's a good things we don't have to conjure up that kindness in ourselves with willpower and good habits! Martin C | ||
| Dljc Registered user Username: Dljc Post Number: 185 Registered: 7-2010 |
Martin, I've learned a lot since becoming a member here at FAF. As you may know I'm one of the never beens that come here. I can only imagine how current Adventists view you all, warning people about them. Two things come to mind: Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you. (Mat 5:10-12) And also Matthew 23. I was recently told by my SDA friend that calling SDAism a cult wasn't Christ like. The aforementioned verses from Matthew 23 is Jesus calling a cult a cult. That's exactly what the Pharisees had created. So how was I [and you all] not being Christ like? Jesus called a spade a spade. And we can see that clearly in Matthew 23. Jesus exposed them for who and what they were. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 11956 Registered: 12-2003  |
Interesting thread, Martin. Oh, yes--I've encountered that "niceness". In fact, just today...but I digress. Kindness tells the truth. Kindness functions within the directives of Jude 22-23:
Some people need mercy; some people need rescuing from mortal danger. Still others need mercy, but our administration of mercy must be mixed with fear, because this category of people are not just in personal danger but are toxic, "radioactive", as our pastor Gary Inrig put it—they contaminate the unwary into whose presence they come. Colleen | ||
| Lucybugg Registered user Username: Lucybugg Post Number: 285 Registered: 2-2007 |
There was a woman at my former church who was always syrupy sweet nice to me, but at the same time made back-handed remarks. I never like her because she was "nice." It seemed as if I could always sense an under current of mean in her. | ||
| Martinc Registered user Username: Martinc Post Number: 203 Registered: 9-2006 |
The perfect text, Colleen. None of us is perfect, that we know, but trust begins with forgiveness and honesty. These are the reasons that the FAF Friday night study and this forum are so precious. The conversations are not so loaded up with the "guile" one usually hears in most religious gatherings. People are friendly, but the sweetness is not mixed with radioactivity. I never worry what any of them are doing behind my back. This is not to say that in this group, there isn't conflict and hurt feelings at times. There has been and will be. We, the rescued "spades," have a safer place to fight, because know we have been truly forgiven and accepted. Martin C |
