| Author | Message | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2616 Registered: 8-2004  |
In this interview, Eliza Griswold states, "There is a very profound religious clash that we’re missing. It is not the clash between Christianity and Islam. It is the clash inside of religions. It is the question between Christians over who has the right to speak for God. Those same questions are going on inside Islam today, and yet we don’t hear very much about it." I thought I'd pose the question here on the forum. Who has the right to speak for God? Where is spiritual authority found? | ||
| Skeeter Registered user Username: Skeeter Post Number: 1104 Registered: 12-2007 |
No one has the right to "speak for God" He speaks for Himself through his son Jesus Christ. "Spiritual authority" is found in His word as given to us through the Bible. Francie | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2617 Registered: 8-2004 |
 true enough. So what do you look for when discerning when someone who claims to have heard from God actually heard from God and not from their own imagination or from some more diabolical source? | ||
| Gorancroatia Registered user Username: Gorancroatia Post Number: 126 Registered: 6-2010 |
Safely, it do not depend on us , although we are called to discern spirits, but ALL things are subdued to Christ, and He is at the right hand of God (1 Pet, and Col 1). God Revelations himself and to one the truth, and to other which dont give respect to truth God send a lie. So I see God speaks throughout all things.Even our adversary devil, is used to our perfection throughout sufferings and steadfastness. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 11847 Registered: 12-2003  |
The Holy Spirit gives us life, and the word of God gives us the revealed will and truth about God. People who study the Bible without being born of the Spirit will twist the word of God. People who submit to spiritual experiences without grounding themselves in the words of Scripture will be vulnerable to false teachings and false spirits. Jesus said in John 14:5-11 that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. Our pastor actually preached on this passage yesterday, and he said several important things. First, the definite article "the" is used before "truth", "life," and "way." Jesus is not a truth, a life, or a way, but THE truth, life, and way. Furthermore, Jesus does not show, know, or reveal "the ways"—He is the way. Moreover, He is not only the personal way, but He is the comprehensive way. As Christians, we have a mandate to share this truth because without it, others will be lost. Phillip, Gary pointed out, asked in vv. 8-9 for a theophany. "Show us the Father," he said. He was asking for a miracle, a vision. But Jesus said, "If you've seen me, you've seen the Father." Most of us learned to understand that verse by thinking that the incarnate Jesus came to show us in human terms that we could comprehend how loving the Father is. That is NOT what Jesus is saying. He is saying clearly that if we clearly see Jesus, and if His disciples clearly saw Him, they literally (not by example) saw GOD, because Jesus is God. The power, omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, love, mercy, and grace of the Father is the exact same power, omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, love, mercy, and grace of Jesus. So, those we can listen to as authoritative are those who are made alive by the Spirit by submitting to the Lord Jesus in repentance and acceptance of His gift, and who submit their minds and lives to His will revealed in His word. And even then, those people are only men and women. Even though born again, they are subject to their flesh. Ultimately, God gives us His word as the ground of truth by which to measure "truth-telling", and He gives His Spirit to those in Christ to understand what we read and hear. Colleen | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2618 Registered: 8-2004 |
Good answers. Now another question raised by the interview: Given that we understand truth to be one (rather than multiple truths), what is the best way to deal with people who don't agree with our understanding? How are we, with strong belief in Jesus as the Truth, to interact with others who deny this? | ||
| Skeeter Registered user Username: Skeeter Post Number: 1107 Registered: 12-2007 |
"How are we, with strong belief in Jesus as the Truth, to interact with others who deny this?" That is a hard one... to argue with those who have a heavy "veil" and cannot , or sometimes I think it is more likely WILL not see.. I guess all I personally would be able to do, rather than go round and round in circles arguing points when it is plain they are not listening... is just to let them know that I love them and will continue to pray for them, and then ask God to take over in their lives and show them what I cannot. Francie | ||
| Asurprise Registered user Username: Asurprise Post Number: 1465 Registered: 7-2007 |
Actually Hebrews 1:2,3 says: "God, Who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in the last days spoken to us by HIS SON..." So, Jesus is the one to speak for the Father. I find the E.G.White estate to be so helpful in finding things Ellen White wrote. I just typed in "last days spoken testimonies" in the search box. It led to a bunch of quotes in various books. I found this one in "Believe His Prophets..." and I clicked on "Cached." Clicking on "Cached" makes it so that the target words are in color and you can find them easily. I'll put a quote by Ellen White here where she says who speaks for God: quote: “In ancient times God spoke to men by the mouth of prophets and apostles. In these days He speaks to them by the Testimonies of His Spirit. There was never a time when God instructed His people more earnestly than He instructs them now concerning His will and the course that He would have them pursue.”—Testimonies for the Church, vol. 4, pp. 147, 148. (Message edited by Asurprise on October 19, 2010) | ||
| Surfy Registered user Username: Surfy Post Number: 693 Registered: 11-2007 |
I don't think the original suppositions are correct. I don't think Christianity clashes with Islam. I do feel that Islam clashes with Christianity, though. And is there really a questions between Christians as to who really speaks for God? Again, I don't think so. I think the most held view is that each denomination has something to offer each person that another denomination may not. I see quite a lot of unity in the Body of Christ right now. I think Ms. Griswold is stirring up something just to stir up something. Surfy | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2623 Registered: 8-2004 |
Within those who self-identify as Christian I think there ARE questions - Adventism is not the only church to claim that they are 'the remnant', or that believing their distinctive doctrine is a necessity for salvation. . . . but my question, which I apparently didn't word very well, is "How do we interact with people who belong to mutually exclusive truth systems?" We pray for the conversion of muslims, for example, and they look for our conversion to their faith. But we both live in this world. How does this work in the everyday world? | ||
| Gorancroatia Registered user Username: Gorancroatia Post Number: 135 Registered: 6-2010 |
You are asking deep questions. We are so conform to free democratic life, that we forget that there are exclusive truth systems which aims to get the world. How to interact depends of situations. From tolerance toward defense. We believe that there is only One true God, so His domain is all world and in all groups. | ||
| Asurprise Registered user Username: Asurprise Post Number: 1472 Registered: 7-2007 |
All the cults claim to be the ONLY voice for God. Helovesme2, are you talking about them? | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 2625 Registered: 8-2004 |
Thanks Gorancroatia, you did speak to what I'm asking. Asurprise - of course cults claim to be the only voice for God! We Christians also claim to know the only way to God (and I believe we are right). But no, I'm not speaking about cults specifically, I'm speaking in general. We believe that God is the ultimate authority, and we have a pretty clear definition of who we understand Him to be - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. We have a defined cosmology, world view, and practical, basic beliefs about how the world should be. We welcome converts to Christianity, and understand one of the purposes of our existence to be 'making disciples of all nations.' We have a lot invested in Jesus Christ as THE Way, Truth, and Life. I, for one, am eternally grateful that Jesus is my Savior. . . . But we are not the only ones in the world who think we have 'the way.' There are adherents of Islam, Bahai, and Sikh religious systems who also believe that they have found the way the world ought to be. There are also many who actively participate in a multitude of non-evangelizing ethnic religions, and plenty who claim no religion at all. As Christians, we are living witnesses to the gospel, and as such rejoice when God uses us to bring others to Himself. We understand that our citizenship is in heaven, but we are also part of this world in our respective families, communities, and nations. So how does this work? How are we, as individual Christians and as a community, to deal with others who are NOT searching for the one true way - whether that is because they believe they have already found the way, or because they believe such a thing does not exist? | ||
| Bb Registered user Username: Bb Post Number: 819 Registered: 7-2004 |
This makes me think of Matthew 5:11. Maybe we aren't to feel that we have to deal with those who don't want to hear, unless God draws us to them. He is the one who hardens hearts of those who will not hear, and His Spirit draws those who are His. 11"Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. | ||
| Gorancroatia Registered user Username: Gorancroatia Post Number: 137 Registered: 6-2010 |
Some do find the way. I studied Bhagavad Gita, and find in essence similar faith like in Jesus Christ, aldouth said in diferent culture and in diferent way. Krisna and Christ, even the name is similar.(in Croatian have "K": Krist and Krisna) In essence, they bout have atributetes of Word of God, Son of God - in Bible language. So, my expirience is that we must not insist on terms and concepts, but the content. To fundamentalists that can be insult, but cultic trap can be in all forms, even in Christianity form. Remember that Jesus didnot originate Christianity like religion, He done what He was sent for. Everithing else comes latter... Hope I not insult someones faith. |
